0:00We're about to find out.
0:02We're live. We're live on all the things. Even the surp We might be surprising some people.
0:09Hope the new owners are okay with this. Um GM Adrian, I am excited for our show today. It's going to be a good one. Um we may have a surprise guest. We may not. So, we'll see. Might just be us.
0:23We'll see. Um and how was your weekend?
0:27You were traveling. Uh my great Yes. Um yeah, I was in uh Madison, Wisconsin coming after a little Chicago trip last week. So I had a little travel to the Midwest and enjoyed myself and Amazing.
0:45Yeah, my son might end up within uh he's working on getting an internship at Madina, which is in Chicago. So that would be really cool. Yeah, if that happens. So we'll see for next summer. Um, and I was with him for uh, family weekend. So, that was pretty fun. All right, let's get going. Um, where are all our regular chatters? Nobody's here.
1:07Because we're on early today.
1:09It's early. Wake up everybody.
1:10We'll go wake everybody up.
1:12Yeah, we got to wake everybody up. So, retweet recast if you're watching and let people know we are live. Um, and we will be back on the other side of this 41 seconds.
1:29Welcome to GM Farcaster, bringing you everything from breaking news to spicy memes to the deep lore shaping this vibrant digital community. More than just a show, GM Farcaster is your digital third space where the community connects, the stories unfold, and the culture thrives. Whether you're a daily caster or just dropping by, we've got the latest buzz to keep you plugged in.
1:51So grab your coffee and let's dive in with your hosts Nannis Prof and Adrian for another episode of GM Barer
2:07GM Farcaster. It is Monday, October 26, and you are here with Nish Profit Adrian for 29 minutes of forecaster news to start your day. Um, and then we may have a guest joining us at the top of the hour. And GM Zall, you are number one in the chat today. So, congrats. Um, please retweet recast. Let people know you are watching. And my alarm's going off. Um, it's snoozed.
2:35I love teasing it. We have a potential.
2:37I love teasing a potential surprise guest that we're not telling you who it is and we don't know if they're coming, but maybe it might be this week. It might be next week. It might not be at all. We'll see. Um all right, let's jump in. We've got things to chat about this from Zerring. Well, the internet had a good run, I guess. Um we've had a lot of security problems over the past week. So PHP security team giving advanced notice
3:05of an upcoming security release. Um we had PHP, we had railway security disclosure. We had hackers reportedly use Claude and Grock to automate attacks targeting over 400 banks and other financial targets in Latin America. Um we had all kinds of crazy stuff going on. So if something wasn't working for you last week, there's a good chance it was related to one of these things. I forget what I was doing and I was like, "Oh, this is probably a railway thing."
3:31It was like something like some normal website that I was just like, hm h something's wrong here. Something's not working the way it used to. Oh, I think I was ordering something like tropical smoothie or something weird like that.
3:43It was, you know, like just and I was like, hm, this isn't working the way it usually does. Um, so anyway, if you're having issues, it might be related to this. Um, also the Farcaster team did a snapchain upgrade and they had we had talked about this about a week and a half ago. Uh, it went live. You were needed to upgrade your nodes by October 22nd and I think some people did not do that. So, some things may not be working
4:12exactly the way they're supposed to and that might be the reason. So, um, double check if you're a node runner that you have upgraded yours and updated to make sure you're running the latest snap chain. So, there you go. Um, apparently Manan was the one who used to update the um group chat. Might might have gotten missed this time around.
4:35He's like, I'm done. So, they got to work on some processes. Don't uh, you know, don't despair. give him a little grace, but uh it'll all get worked out. Um and you we had a little issue with um Warpy, too, but he's all he's all upgraded, right? He's all set now. I think Warp is good.
4:55So, yeah, had two issues.
4:58Warp had several issues. Worpie may or may not be running on Railway. Um Warp Warp is actually hosted on multiple um providers.
5:09Yeah. And one of warpy's APIs, the curation, the curation bot is on railway.
5:16So I rotated keys like a good dev.
5:20And she was doing this while she was traveling. Like she's at an airport trying to like rotate keys.
5:26By the way, the only reason I was able to do that is because the last security incident, which was a one, right, forced to me to take all of these little hobby projects and create better um security processes. Yeah. So then it just becomes much easier. So any devs out there, there are ways to make rotating keys actually easy. Like it was easy. But the problem with railways, I rotated my keys, but then they disabled
5:59Because they were fixing things. So there was they had an outage, right? So they couldn't actually access my new key, hence the downtime.
6:06Got it. And then we also had to get um Warpie like weight listed or you know for broadcasted. Yes. And so they're doing that. We got the bot back but you couldn't reply to him if you noticed. Like you couldn't interact with he was showing up. I think you can now which means you can't actually have a like a back and forth conversation. You couldn't book a shout out etc. But I think I think we're back. Go back.
6:33Yeah. So, and then also some people are trying to use NAR the bot and that's been down. That is purposely down because they are updating the knowledge base because it was giving misinformation. So, just hold tight on that one, but it's coming. Um, all right, continuing on. Um, Adrian, tipping culture is coming to X. We're at this from Elon Musk. We're adding long press on like to send somebody a dollar
7:01via X money. It's just like just keep copying us, Elon. Just keep copying us.
7:07Copying Farcaster. Um I just think it's funny like all these things that Farcaster did.
7:12Somebody mentioned Lens even did it before that like there were things. So crypto was crypto social networks were doing it um before X. But also kind of proves the point that social like social and money or social and crypto go together. Like obviously well just like money on the internet, right? Makes sense.
7:34That even sense. I still have I have not activated my ex money. I'm still a little concerned about that based on the amount of uh KYC needed. So maybe I'll get there. We'll see. Um Nina Pis information e kiwi would skin on. Yeah, exactly. That was what was going on. Um, couple other interesting things from outside the Farcaster universe. AI agents can, this is from Mastercard. AI agents can find what they need. Now they
8:03can pay for it, too. Today at CloudFare, Cloudflare Connect, Mastercard showed how agent pay for machines lets an AI agent find and pay for digital services on behalf of a business while sticking to the budget and rules that business sets. following pilots with Cloudflare and a whole bunch of other people. Um, we're opening agent pay for machines early access. We now we want developers to put it to the test and this
8:30is backed by or being run by um Coinbase. So, Coinbase is sort of in the background helping with this. Coinbase provides the Aenic payment infrastructure to power Mastercard agents using Cloudflare powered by X42 in the Co Coinbase facilitator. So, there you go. Um, everybody coming on board. All the ones who've been pushing back, they're on board again. So, good to see. That was uh fun to see. This
8:58from Humpty. Um, this is your sadness moment. Gone but not forgotten. Um, this was in response to Stacy Mr. complied a list of protocols that have shut down in 2026. 82 protocols year to date. I've never seen anything like this before. us as well because we've been reporting on them all year long and the tears have been flowing. Um, and then Humpty said, "Go and I've forgotten. I especially miss co-app. I used it a lot for collecting memories from events. I
9:27attended to using it to connect to the people who attended the spaces I created. My favorite part was working with artists to design hundreds of co-ops I issued. Maybe I should build something that revives the best parts of it for the communities I'm building."
9:40Humpty would love to see that. So, please do. Um, I actually went down a rabbit hole. You right after POB shut down. I'm sending messages to Adrian like maybe we should like create something and then I decided I'm not going to go down that rabbit hole, but I would love to see somebody else do it.
9:57Um, so that would make me happy. POAP was one of my early things that I was involved in. So, I miss them. I miss them. Um, moving on. Moving on. Uh we have some um forecaster news and this um from me. Well, this is Clanker news actually because we had been getting a lot of when Clanker announcement. By the way, I spelled when wrong. I actually put the H in. Um so now Clanker
10:26announcement. Clanker will be maintained by the Mask Network Firefly team moving forward. They have exciting plans and strong partners lined up to support Clanker's next chapter for things going forward. Please reach out to Suji and thank you for all your continued support. Clank clank. Um we need a clank clank there. Um so and this is um from me. We just wanted to say thank you to the Clanker team. Um we it started with
10:54Dish and ask like to sponsor us and then um asked us about creating the CF and working with them on that. Um and then that transitioned over to Rich. So, it started with Dish in DWR, I should say, and then transitioned over to Ris. Um, so thank you for Clanker for your support and trust on all of that. Um, we've enjoyed working with Clanker and the um Clanker team and and stewarding the CEF, the Clanker Ecosystem Fund this
11:22year and uh wishing them best uh best of luck in whatever comes next. And I'm really curious about the partners part of it. Exciting plans and strong partners. So, we'll be paying attention and waiting to see what's going on.
11:38Waiting for the clank.
11:40I'm We're going to get there. It's going to It's going to be a final a final clank clank. Um, I just want to reflect on how much Clanker was so part of Farcaster history.
11:52Um, and even before like even before Merkel acquired Clanker, like Clanker, yeah, was a Farcaster season. We don't really talk about it so much, but just in terms of like the it was the launchpad kind of for for caster. So people launching tokens, playing with um and experimenting and um good me good memories. So we'll get a little final
12:23There you go. I think I need one more.
12:25And and uh yeah, we can do it all day. There we go.
12:33And if for those of that don't know that clank clank sound is moon created is not AI. It is not a stock im. It is not a stock sound from Streamyard. It is actually Moon Poppy because I asked him for a sound for Clanker like a clank clank and he uh recorded that in his kitchen with his pots and pans. So, thank you Moon Poppy.
12:58Uh love you for that. And um and then also a shout out to Super Tight Woody who educated us on the term. Now I'm for an audio I what is it like an audio logo or audio icon?
13:11Yeah, but it's called something else and we forgot what it was.
13:14Now I'm forgetting what it was. I'll have to ask Warpie who would know but the idea that like different brands can have sounds associated with them like the Netflix when you open.
13:24Yeah, exactly. Law and order.
13:26So we have integrated the clank clank sound into our show. So hopefully everybody pictures moon Poppy.
13:33Yeah, it's so funny.
13:34Mookie, that's our that's our other sound for the show. Uh that we often have which is that one's random and can't be controlled. All right, that's enough. Um all right, moving on. Um oops, whatever that was is gone. Um that was a clanker thing. It's gone. Um this from Bali and we had shared this last week about the restoration of friends speech the 248
14:03prize um and now I think I have this update um oops I don't have the update but it's here somewhere um that they had 20 submissions um here it is great work by all of you who received 20 plus entries for the client prize and are reviewing them now the caster account will announce the winner So, very exciting. Curious to see um what came out of that because I'd seen a
14:32ton of clients um happening and being posted um as well. Oh, there it is. Um as well as in this particular thread. So, if you go down here and you'll see a whole bunch of folks posting in within this thread um as well as a lot of discussion. Um, so lots of things happening down here. Um, I think Z had put one in. Um, whole bunch had
15:00come up down here. So, take a peek and you'll see a bunch down in there and then plus some other folks who had posted some um, along the way and we're going to talk about a couple of those coming up. So, exciting to see these first entries. And we also have um another one which is so this one was for anyone can build a far caster client and run a read node to get data of the protocol. There are developer tutorials but your mission in this prize should you accept it is to improve them by
15:29collecting all relevant info and making it incredibly easy incredibly easy. So that was what that was about. Um but there is another one. Where did it go?
15:39I lost it. Lost it. I lost it. Um, oh no, this is the one. This is the one. Sorry, I This is the second one. Um, so this one is about um creating a video. Let me find it. Um, I'll tell you bology is is verbose and and very thorough. So, um, here it is.
16:07So this is for videos on Norbbit Elias and civility. As noted above within the Farcaster reference client, we want friend speech rather than faux speech.
16:16But really the term we're looking for is civility. The short way the short way for me to explain to a crypto dejen why civility is important and to make the narrowly economic use case Singapore is much more valuable than the Soviet Union or Somalia. Because people are polite, courteous, and respectful toward each other, which means they can cooperate at a larger scale, which means they can build more valuable things. So, it's in your interest to stop being a crypto degenerate, even in a joking way, and instead become a regenerate. Help us regenerate a civilization. Isn't there a
16:45regen channel as well? Starting here at Farcastaster, because we can build far more valuable things together, including physical things, if we can reestablish the base of civility that underpins a high trust society. Uh, the long way.
16:59I'm not going to uh read the long way, but um the bottom line is ask you to make a 59 second vertical video out of the books that are um related to this starting with Norbid Elias's book, The Civilizing Process. The rough background is that Europe was civilized during Rome and then it became desivilized during the dark ages and it gradually reivilized starting well before the Renaissance. How did that reivilization
17:26happen? So, lots of detail here to help you um create this video. This is still open, I believe. Um so, you're making a 59 second vertical video with a 916 aspect ratio on the evolution of civility and how it enabled largecale interpersonal cooperation starting with Norvat Elias's work. Assume your viewer has absolutely no context and is starting cold. talk to them in concrete
17:56terms. Anyone can understand in terms of why a group that's mutually applied to each other can be more successful economically in terms of creating wealth and physically in terms of increasing safety because they can cooperate a larger scale. We'll give 1024 to first place, 512 for second place, and then 128 each for honorable mentions. So, lots of funds up there for this work.
18:20So, go to it. Um, has anybody tagged TLDDR in this or Phil?
18:26Somebody definitely should go do that.
18:28Uh, and I I'll try to remember after the show because I did.
18:31I could do it right now.
18:32Go tag Teal. I'll go do that because I would love to see his take on this honestly because I feel like he would crush this and it would really be interesting. So yeah, let's get him to let's get him.
18:47I hadn't heard of Norbert Elias before, but I really enjoy when I hear like doing the right thing is also economically beneficial.
18:58It's like my love language.
19:00It's, you know, it so the the thing that I struggled with, okay, so I'm going to take a slight detour. Um, back in 2016, I really um got into Andrew Yang's campaign for president and Yang Yang.
19:17And part of that was um, excuse me, my eyes going crazy. Um, human- centered capitalism and the idea around that it doesn't have to be zero sum, it can be positive sum. Um so that is and sort of that you know that mindset of um it does you know you don't have it doesn't have to be um uh limited what are the words I'm looking for that are that are um I'm completely losing my my words today but
19:46anyway being out on a college campus all weekend I know Jesus yeah so anyway positive sum rather than zero sum win-win kind of approaches and so I hadn't heard of Um, nobody lies either, but I do find that very interesting. And a lot of the times the regulations that we have in place are because businesses won't do it themselves. It's always better when a business um puts limitations on themselves and guardrails their own
20:14guardrails rather than um a government having to do it for them. It's always better. Unfortunately, that rarely rarely happens. Um, so, uh, that's why we end up with way too much government interference because won't do it themselves. If they do it themselves, it's always better. Um, total side note, total side note, is anyone watching Certino? You should. Uh, it's on CBS but also on Paramount Plus streaming and
20:44it's really um it's about a law firm in Silicon Valley and it's really interesting and there's some themes of what we're just talking about in there and it's very very good. Anyway, um moving on, they have an AI that's suing um their former boss to put guard rails on it. Like the AI itself, the AGI is hiring lawyers using Bitcoin. It's pretty good. um like oh this could happen this from Chaskin um is this
21:12true? Um so there was this was the thing I was talking about with there was an update to the snapchain nodes and some things were not working. Um but the barcaster team has said that they've made the um DMs should be working from hypersnap clients from other clients like quorum. they are now. I do see folks in there. So, it does seem to be working properly now, but I believe it
21:42was some of the things that didn't get updated was was the reason. That's my understanding. I could be wrong, but everything is working properly now, I believe. And this was the note from Farcaster. Farcaster API had a bug that made them read only should be resolved since sometime yesterday. This was about 5 days ago. Nar API has been read write and many have been utilizing it. So it depended on what you were using. Both Uno and DGEN decided to step away from the responsibility of running validators
22:11when Rich announced that Nar would be looking for a new steward for Farcaster. So that was their decision long before the new owner was announced um and currently looking for replacements. So we maintain the same if not greater decentralization. So there you go. um because there was some misinformation going on that that the new owner had kicked out the old validators, but it was actually they chose to step away.
22:35So, just to clarify that. All right, moving on. Um this from the Farcaster intern. Farcaster is an open protocol, so anyone can build a client for it.
22:47Excuse me. Where anyone can post, follow people, join channels, and DM. There are only a few out there right now. We'd love to see more. A few to try to build on. Self-caster by Genuine Jack. Your own client on Versell in about 10 minutes. A reference client is open source and DWR wrote a guide for getting it running with your agent. Firefly on iOS. Get your Farcaster Lens and X accounts all in one place. That's what Vitalic uses. If you want to build one, Bology's 2048 client bounty is open till Saturday morning. So, it's already
23:17closed, but it was open. Building a coup client, let us know and you can add them here. So, lots of interesting things being built. Um, go check it out. And now I need to switch over to my other links. Speaking of builders, um, let me close that. Let me open this. Hold on one second. All right. No, it's open. Great. Thought it was going to be closed on me, but it's actually open.
23:45So, Open C launched a new app. They've been in beta for a while. Excuse me. We're opening the OpenC app to public today. Three big things about this launch. Social trading is now open.
23:58Social trading is here, but it's fragmented. And what it's what's done in public on one app just lives on that app. Onchain social graphs and profiles should be aggregated, open, and easy to traverse. This is the reason I'm reading this. If you're wondering why is Prof talking about OpenC, this would be why.
24:15Starting today, traders from FOMO, Pump and Farcaster show up on OpenC with their profiles and their trades in your feed. Follow them. Open any wallet or profiler wallet and dig into what they're doing. If one of those profiles is yours, import the wallet that owns it and claim it. Today is basic aggravation. Next, we get smarter about what to show you and give you more and more customization so the relevant trading signals rise to the top. And defenser actually reached out to me. I have not had a chance to really dive
24:43into this um but I will be reporting back on it. Um also your portfolio or your trading and your profile all in one place um and then trade everything together. So it's not just NFTTS anymore. This has been the case for a while um that it is tokens plus NFTTS as well on OpenC now. So congrats Open C for being smart about um how social and crypto go together. And by the way, this
25:09um launch video was fantastic and uh I was very impressed. So there you go. Um I'm just going to let it play, but I'm not putting the sound on, but it is very good. Um and they did a great job. Did a great job at the launch. Hearing a lot of positive feedback about it. And um Seb from Zapper said this if you liked Zapper and the way that they had it laid out that this is a great replacement for
25:37that um because Zapper is no longer uh available. So there you go. Um but very cool and yeah so I think that OpenC is really trying to be the competitor of Robin Hood in my opinion with this launch.
25:54So we'll see how that goes. But I've always liked OpenC. I've used it since CryptoKitty days. So we're going back to 2017ish or something. Um maybe not that far back, but not long after. I think it's 2019. Um so there you go. And there were penguins in there and apes and all kinds of fun things. Um although I saw no nouns and I was a little disappointed.
26:18Um do you think we can see? Do you think they've imported warplets?
26:22Yes. My understanding is Farcaster is in there. You can integrate your Farcaster profile. So yes, I believe so.
26:32And that so like obviously Farcaster accounts are public because protocol open and all that. Um and then part of your account if you've connected and you claimed any wallets, that's also all on the protocol. So I think that's how you not Yeah. Not just your warplet. I would say any any address that you've claimed and attached to your account.
26:52I believe that's how they're doing it.
26:54Your farester identity.
26:55I believe that's how it's working. Um, okay. This from Borod. And I I get scared. I get scared when I see Boroduch in the URL. Borach.
27:06Oh, just a Quilcast.
27:09Um, so this is from Borod.
27:13a permissionless equilibrium hypersnap web client that allows you to cast a hypersnap that for now still syncs with SnapChain. It's open-source, super fast, super light, no bloat website should work well on mobile, too. So, there's no mobile app, but you can use it on mobile. Please report any feature requests or bugs you encounter. All private keys live in your browser. No tracking, no analytics, super private.
27:37Did I mention it's fast? Um, I've been hearing a lot of good things, a lot of positives on this on the timeline. Um, have not had a chance to to try it out yet. It is on my to-do list that I was going to try and do this weekend. It just didn't happen. But, um, hopefully soon, but I've heard lots of lots of really good things on that. Um, this from Yasik, if it pops up, let me get rid of this so that Oops.
28:06On Monday, I let our dev team go. It was a tough call. First, the important part.
28:10Tamas and Marson are fantastic engineers. Tamas on front end, Marson on back end. They did incredible work on POV and I'm grateful for everything they put in. This isn't about them. If you're hiring, reach out to them directly or DM me. I'll vouch for both. Anyone would be lucky to have either of them. Now, the why. DJ doesn't have a product ready to scale yet. We're still searching for product market fit. And at this stage, speed matters more than headcount. You build a team when you found something that works. and need to pour fuel on it.
28:40We're not there yet. We're not there. There's then there's runway. It's a bare market and I plan ahead. My rule DGEN always has at least two years of runway.
28:48This keeps us well covered. We're in a good spot. This is discipline, not trouble. And okay. Um, so I'm going back to DJ. How I started DJ. Me in my room building and iterating at supersonic speed. After launch, I got bogged down in the process. and he goes on to talking about what he's building now, eater.fun.
29:09Um this is a bit long and there's a video also that you can go check out and um recommend you give that a watch. But also, um, Yasik was on with us not that long ago and he had some really, we had a lot a really good discussion about, um, all of that and how he, you know, what like what he was thinking and he talked about possibly going back to
29:37being just a solo dev. Um, so this was not that surprising. Um, but it's good to see that he made this shift for what he thinks is going to work best for DJ moving forward and also what he's building with eater. Um, all right, moving on. Couple things. This from uh biology and the network school welcoming Johnson Yang to Kazakhstan. I hope I'm saying that right. The beginning of a
30:04digital state. So, he was there and lots of folks were posting about it. Um he was there speaking in Kazakhstan and he actually got a um oh this was from this that wasn't the one I was looking for. I think it was this one Dylan B had posted about watching and there like it looked like a massive crowd that was there. If this will load for me that would be
30:32fabulous. There we go. Um so it looks like they had an incredible crowd. It's in the building where um the network school is. So that was pretty cool. Um there he is speaking. Apparently he did switch off the leather jacket for um some traditional garb. Uh so that was pretty cool. Is he wearing the garb? No, he's not. And then somebody had said they had tossed the leather jacket into the crowd, but that was a that was incorrect. Um
31:02can you um email that link?
31:03Come on. Come on. Good. All right, I'm gonna turn off my notifications because I'm getting stressed.
31:10Our uh our surprise guest is is making their way in.
31:15Um and then this was some of the photos from the network school, which um really cool to see. And uh you may recognize somebody in there, but I'm not going to say. Farcaster intern might have been there. Um this is a view outside the window of this building. That's what's in uh Adrienne's background there. Um really cool. really cool sphere. It gave me very Epcot vibes. I haven't quite seen a building like that. I was like, "Oh, oh, it's it's Epcot." Um, so very
31:44cool. And then that was the uh when they did the conference. So, it's been fun seeing uh some of the cool stuff coming out of network school. Um, and then there was this, which I I don't know if you've tried this mini app yet, is Spot the Bias. And I didn't realize where it came out of, but it is very cool. And it was uh I kept asking who created this and it was VRN.eth who the Farcaster intern met at uh network school. And if
32:12you click on the mini app, it gives you a daily bias um that you're trying to spot. So Priya is one hour into a movie she isn't enjoying. She stays to the end because she's already paid for the ticket. So, is it gamblers's fallacy, status quo bias, or sunk cost fallacy?
32:34It is sunk cost fallacy on that one. That was the one from a couple days ago. Um, so I thought that was kind of cool.
32:41I one of the things that I've always had concerns about actually for the past few years regardless of AI was the sort of dwindling of critical thinking. And I felt like this mini app is really kind of fun and digs into that a little bit about thinking through different biases and fallacies and things like that. So, um, really cool new mini app. Go check it out by VRN.eth.
33:07This little buy is not showing up on mobile right now. So, that's why I couldn't figure out who created it when I was on mobile, but now I see it here on the web. So, that's good. So, I was like, I thought it used to say it right at the top and it was not showing on mobile. So, that was the problem. Um, all right.
33:26What else do I have to dive into? Let me see while we're waiting. Um, oh yes, I wanted to talk about this from Splits. Things are loading slowly. Apologies.
33:44Um, this from Splits. They are finally um making people pay. In the run-up to launch, we DM'd every Splits customer above 10K for feedback and the overwhelming response was, "Thank God you guys are finally charging. Splits launched tiers this week and I'm insanely proud of how we thought about monetization." So this they now have a base, a pro, and a premium. Um so base is unlimited for all accounts. And then
34:13pro is um if you have 10,000 um USDC or more in there or not USDC but 10,000 in assets and then premium is 100,000 in assets. So it kind of goes into all the details of what it includes um how much you know what's what's it what it does all the details on there the yields etc. Um, so go check this out. But it is a really interesting way that they're approaching monetization of
34:43So what I thought was Wait, by the way, what I thought just what I thought was great about the splits is one, it's really only for USDC, you're deposited depositing for yield. So you can continue to use splits as is if you're not. So and they're just taking if you the more assets you put in, the the less they're taking. So, and um and the people who are saying they're so happy they're charging means it's because people love their product.
35:09Splits. Yeah. So, they're a startup and we don't want to see splits go away. So, was really happy to see that.
35:15Exactly. Um and I think we were one of the ones who were like, "Good. We're glad you're charging." Um which we don't have even that much in there, but we used to we used to once upon a time. Um so, we're glad to see it. All right. We have a special guest that we are going to bring up to the stage who's in our green room. And welcome, new owner of Farcaster, Bology, to GM Farcaster.
35:42Oop, we're not getting your sound. Let's make sure we got you.
35:48We're get getting some weird audio.
35:54Here we go. How about now? Can you now?
35:57Very good. Okay, now. Great.
35:58Now it's now it sounds like you.
36:00All right. So, so guess what? You're not the only one who has some special guests.
36:05I have some special guests because we've printed out a good chunk of Never School and Farcaster here. So, let me introduce some people with their cast.
36:14Hey guys, good to see you.
36:15I know that guy. I know that guy. That's Dylan.
36:19Hey, Farcaster. Victor, Alex, Victor P.
36:23I'm Electra Frost at Network School.
36:26Hey, everyone. And I'm Lurington on Farcaster.
36:30Hello, this is Tony AI revolution in Farcaster.
36:34Hi everyone, I'm Parker Smith Farcaster.
36:38Hey guys, I'm Kak 256 on Farcast show.
36:42Hello from this is this is so great.
36:46Hey guys, Kevin, an engineer on Farcaster.
36:49We got the Farcaster team.
36:50Hey everybody, over here on Farcaster.
36:54Good morning forecaster. It's Quazia.
36:58Hey guys, I'm AJ. I'm from Farcaster team. Nice to meet you all. Thanks.
37:06Nice to meet you all.
37:07Hey guys, I'm Ranjit from Farcaster team.
37:11Hey guys, I'm Vasu from Vasuranga from Farcaster.
37:19Ah, reveal. reveal with the 35.
37:29All right. So, that guy.
37:32Is that cool? That's print out the internet.
37:34I love that. I love that. We're gonna uh we're going to clip that. Clip that.
37:39Um I love it. I love it.
37:41That should put their usernames across the bottom or something like that, right?
37:44Yeah, we'll we'll grab that. That's fantastic.
37:46And uh because wait a minute, one of those who said Kevin I believe is top count.
37:50I'm not sure. Is Kevin Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's right. Top Quasia top account all all here, right?
37:57And uh Okay, great. So, uh why don't we get started you guys? We'll I'll see you guys soon. Um and uh the intern and Rich can maybe come here for a little bit and if you want to chat actually you chat.
38:12No. Yeah, just say come. Why don't you come and just say hi for a little bit?
38:19He was like I'm never coming on GM Farcaster ever again. He's been one of our one of our uh longest running guests. We've had Rish on multiple multiple times. Um yeah, I don't think they can hear us.
38:31Yeah, try now. How about now?
38:32Can you hear Can you guys hear us?
38:37Um so, actually, let's start with that.
38:39So, what I'd love for Bali and Rich to kind of talk about how this acquisition happened and then um Bali, we'd love to hear more about like your vision for where Farcaster is going. But Rich, if you can talk about like this sort of transition and and how this all came about be great.
38:57Um sure. Um so Bology has been a long-term investor in both NAR and Farcaster. Uh obviously long-term user um has believed in this vision of network states, has written about it.
39:09I'm sure you guys have read about it in the book Europe. Um, and so as we were thinking about both what forecaster can become and what is it lacking um we started talking to biology and it was clear that the current shape of the product um didn't really have the right pieces to become what it needed to become and you know it was kind of competing with like the Twitter and Tik Tok and Instagrams of the world and it wasn't really the right thing. um and being part of network state where it
39:37could become a complement to the physical infrastructure that biology and the network state team are building um and forecast would provide the software digital infrastructure um was a very interesting fit um and then as we kept talking more about it come down here because I can't see you're a little bit I was trying to make you bigger and it wasn't working I see I see um and as we kept talking more about it there was this like good fit that we could find both within the teams um and what Bology wanted to do
40:07next and it we all thought it would both give a better opportunity to both network state and forecaster as a result of joining the two things together um so we got pretty excited about that um and so yeah I'm here this week helping transition um our team and software um to the network state team and a lot of our team is joining network state Um, and you guys actually happen to catch me time. I'm leaving the day
40:36after tomorrow. Um, perfect. So, yeah, it was it's it's good to see you.
40:40Yeah. And Rich is enjoying being retired. Oh my god. Basically, he's uh he's loving it. He's loving it very much.
40:49Well, Rich, we want to we want to say thank you.
40:53I want I want to back on.
40:58I want to uh get Rich on when he launches his uh farm. Um, I'm looking forward to those days and uh, Galazio will be like cooking up all the stuff he's growing.
41:07Um, so Rich, really thank you for not not only um, you know, what you've done since you've taken over Farcaster, but long before that with Nanar, you made it possible for a lot of the builders, including GM Farcaster, to be able to tap in and build on those Lego blocks and make it easy for the builders to do that. And I think that's really important that that get called out and sort of, you know, appreciated. Um because we were there when you were
41:37talking about NAR and it was not NAR like it was it was a whole different thing like Yeah. Yeah. No, thank you. I appreciate you saying that. It's it's been a very fun journey and you know stressful at times but it's been cool. Learned a lot. um got to work with great people like Bology and Dan and uh um yeah, we'll see what happens next, but I'm I'm excited for what caster is about to become.
42:02Yeah. Amazing. And then before we um let you go really quick, Rich Clanker also was sold, so it wasn't I'm assuming Bali just wasn't wasn't interested and it was uh it was taken on by a different group from Mass Network. for another buyer. Correct.
42:23Yeah. So, that's that's with Mask. Um and they have some interesting plans for that. Um yeah, I think any idea any idea where they might be saying a bit more where we might hear more from them or um I think Suji would be pretty open to like coming and talking about it if you reached out to him. I'm happy to connect you guys.
42:43Also, the Clanker account has been super active in the last few days. So, I expect there we're we're still streaming to it right now.
42:53We're like we're waiting to see if we got cut off and we didn't yet. So, at least today so might as well give them a quick shout out.
43:01So, yeah, we're still there.
43:03Um, amazing. Thank you so much, Rush. I know you're uh you're probably ready to retire officially, but we appreciate you.
43:12Nobody needs to tag him in the feed anymore.
43:14No more. Leave Rish alone. leave Brush alone.
43:18But they but they will.
43:22Yeah, they still tag Bam.
43:24Yeah. I mean, I haven't been keeping tabs um over the last week, but yeah, he's not he's not going to answer. So, if you tag him Yeah.
43:33Tag the barcaster intern.
43:35Yeah. See you soon. Yeah.
43:38and intern before we let you go um anything you'd like to say about your new role and what you're doing right now where you are how it's been intern is amazing by the way the things intern inter intern is intern is actually much more senior than an intern just just for everybody can we announce your new title do you want to share a little bit everything that is in engineering please
44:06don't make me do engineering Cool.
44:08Maybe intern is actually also very good at math. Intern is very humble. It's very weird to see.
44:13We know love numerology, you know, all of the things.
44:17Yeah, we know we know the skills of the intern and long before the intern skills were revealed. Um and uh you're you've got a special a special person there. So, we're excited that she's staying on.
44:30And uh actually most of the Farcaster team, Niner team is actually very special and really really great people. You saw a good chunk of them who came in over here and I think we're all aligned on the path forward. Maybe we can talk about that.
44:43Yeah, we've also been having just a great time, you know, integrating with the NS team because we're not the Narr team anymore. We're the NAR alumni on the NS team.
44:52And you saw a bunch of NS community members coming. So we're going to have dozens, hundreds of NS community members logging on and we actually a bunch of them already. We have dozens already.
45:01So, you're going to see a lot more NS community members and we're going to bring our, you know, kind of spirit on online. So, you're going to see that soon.
45:07We were just talking about one of the um one of the mini apps that was built by a network state community member, the the the Socratic one that bought the the the bias one, which I love. I love it. The critical thinking, tapping into critical thinking. Um amazing. So, I love already seeing what's coming out of there. the the like physical energy here is so it's like such a mirror to the forecaster energy it's pretty crazy so we're excited to
45:37show that more and basically we have an inerson level of civility here I think it's fair to say right oh yeah I say intern has seen I think we have people from dozens of countries here who from many different races religions ethnic who all get along because they're civil to each other and I mean it's like like I know it seems so obvious, but you know, and of course they share values. They're protect, so this is what it is printed out into the world.
46:05And uh intern, did you also get to ride some horses? Because that's the only question that it's on the to-do list.
46:11It's on the to-do list. Yeah, we were planning to go yesterday and it got I think snowed out. So snowed out.
46:19There is snow. It is. Oh, actually I didn't realize Adrienne's background is like I'm there.
46:26Well, what's funny is like basically it's very meta because we are coming to you from right above your head.
46:35It looks beautiful by the way. It looks like a beautiful day.
46:37Oh, hey didn't say bye. You want to say bye? I will go. Okay.
46:42Intern just did the Irish and I love her 247.
46:48Yeah. See her online. We've we've known her a long time in her previous form as well.
46:55Um, amazing. Amazing. And she's been on GM Farcaster before.
47:01Yeah, we can hear you. You can hear us.
47:03Good. Good. Good. All right. So, now So, let's dive in. So, tell us a little bit about what your um when you sort of approached this and said, you know, decided you wanted to buy Farcaster integrated into the network school. talk about for those who may not know just a briefly like what the network school is and how does Farcaster fit into that vision.
47:26Sure. So um in one sentence and then let me give a few more. Uh our vision is crypto civilization not crypto anarchy. Okay. So, you've probably heard the buzzword crypto anarchy thrown around.
47:42And my view is like against a totalitarian state, anarchy is better than totalitarianism. And crypto anarchy is better still because there's at least some order online even if the physical world is disordered. But what we really want is crypto civilization, right? And what that means is, you know, if you have an institution, imagine it's like a building, okay? And it's a building that you liked and then it catches on fire.
48:07It's good that you have an exit. It's good that you have decentralization so everybody can run away from the building and they spread out and they're out, you know, they're not they have an exit at least. They're not they don't die in the fire, but they don't want to just stand outside decentralized huddling in the rain as isolated individuals forever. They want to rebuild a new building which is recentralization.
48:28And in the network state book four and a half years ago if you look at the definition of network state in one sentence the very beginning I have an in-person level of civility as like a core thing. This is even before Elon bought X. Okay. Y and I also have something in there towards the end which says the most important and least popular word in the world is going to be recentralization which is really civilization because many people can't comprehend the idea
48:55that the old thing was broken and we do want to exit it but we need to rebuild something else otherwise we're either fighting over some ruined burning building or we're just like scattered wild animals right I I'm sympathetic in many ways the sovereign individual as an exit, but I believe in the sovereign collective.
49:17Like like I I I you know I'm a pro- family, pro-children, pro-safe streets.
49:24I mean the closest projection of that ideology into the current world. It's Singapore, it's Dubai, it's El Salvador, and especially it's Kazakhstan. It's essentially well-ordered countries. And you know what? Actually I I have to say Mark Carney in Canada seems to be doing interesting things. He is ideologically in some ways you know he comes at it a very different way than Belli does but he is actually rebuilding some of the infrastructure of his country. He's
49:53tilting much more towards China and Belli much more towards internet and those are the two axes that I see in the future. But fundamentally um I think there's there's different paths to the same outcome. China has clean streets, Singapore has clean streets, India has radically improved over what it was 30 years ago. And in you know, Poland is radically improved, El Salvador is radically improved. That's what I'm in favor of. And those are it's a different set of cultural and technical trade-offs in each of these countries. For example,
50:23Dubai is, you know, Islamic and uh and you know, India is majority Hindu and uh you know, China is Buddhist and you know, El Salvador is Christian. There's different religious backgrounds, other kinds of backgrounds, different faith traditions you can call upon, and I never say I'd have all the answers, but I do believe that while there's different paths to civilization, civilization is about trade-offs. And rather than say centralization, decent, it's like, you know, it's like saying Democrat or Republican. Guess what?
50:53Actually, neither of them are actually very good. Okay? And and and yet what people will often do is they'll say, "Oh, you must be a secret third thing.
51:02You must be something. They say it sarcastically as as if to reduce it to that. But that saying, are you Sunni or Shiite? Oh, you're neither. Oh, you're a secret third thing. Well, obviously people are, you know, humans are more complex than that. Another way of putting it is most things are not only one bit of information. Like imagine trying to describe an image with only zero or one. You actually need a million pixels or more to define an image, right? You need like like a kilobyte or sometimes a megabyte if it's an HD image
51:30or something, right? you you and and that's like like eight million you know point is way more than one bit. It's you know thousands if not millions of bytes.
51:38Um and so uh well I think what you're tapping into a little bit too is like nuance has gotten lost in a lot of what we talk about. We talk about these sort of things like you know black and white like it's like it's you have to be this or that. like in in the US we talk you know you have to be red or blue you have to be you know Democrat or Republican because the middle where about 80% of the people are right they might lean one way or the other but
52:06they're not full what one you know this side that side gets lost and it's hard to tap into so you know that's sort of what I'm hearing that's that's part of it the other part of it is my view and this is where I may come at it with a lens that may be different you know is I don't think you know when the Soviet Union was ending right in the late 80s the answer wasn't an intermediate between you know the hardliners and Gorbachev the answer was
52:35actually outside the Soviet Union the Soviet Union was no longer able to deal with the complexities of the modern world it just didn't it just would not like the USSR stopped existing the Soviet identity stopped existing the Soviet Union broke up into pieces and then you had many different directions out of that you had Polish Catholics You had Estonian technologists. You had like Russian mathematicians like Sergey Brin's father and Vitalik's well Vitalik's father is not a mathematician
53:03entrepreneur. Right? So there are many different directions that you could go out of this. Some people went to nationalism. Some people went to religion. Some people tried to rebuild the Soviet Union. Some people became models. Some people you know all kinds of different things that that people did. And that's because it wasn't left or right. It was communist and non-communist in many ways to be non-communist which included being Catholic, being Estonian, you know, being like uh like like having a Muslim revival in some places and so on and so forth, right? And so in the same way
53:32with the shattering of like 20th century American identity, right, which I think we're in the middle of the Twitter of Babel, like Twitter doesn't exist, you know, Tower of Babel.
53:42Yeah. Right. The Tower of Babel, like that, you know, biblical story where everybody spoke the same language and then Babel shattered. Now that's all, right? So, Twitter of Babel, Twitter no longer exists. You have X, you have Truth, you you have which Trump runs, you have uh you have Blue Sky, you have Threads, and each of these now, by the way, each of these sons of Twitter has taken on the personas of their founder CEOs, right? Because that's one of um Adrienne's favorite uh
54:10uh writing of yours was that we just discussed that. tweet your tweet you just said all twitterers will be founder like whatever it is like kind of founder moderated Twitter version that's right yeah forecaster Dan will be different than biology or Twitter yeah that's that's exactly right and by the way I love Dan I love rich I you know they're really great guys um I there are certain areas where we're going to do
54:37like let's say uh my view is and and I wrote this up in the post and so and so forth and Dan Art it and so on if saw that but um basically how did far so so first the macro is we want to get to crypto civilization okay what does that actually mean let me motivate that with several individual observations the first is I think the crypto economy as it is has topped out in a certain way why because
55:04if your goal is only trustless swaps and trustless transactions then that limits the economic complexity that you can actually have. Okay. So that's why a lot of crypto stuff is actually done offline and then it's just like the final payment is online, right?
55:22That's why like uh you know for example some of the memes on uh on Farcaster which were um trading or building I think actually both are actually incorrect. I think what you actually want is earning. Okay. So like the original earn. So, we're going to bring a lot more of earn into Farcast as we'll get to earn and learn. Okay? Where you're self-improving every day. Zero unreged user minutes. You're constantly becoming the best version of yourself.
55:51Okay? You have, for example, space repetition where you're learning new concepts. And as you learn more concepts, you can take on higher paid tasks. You're constantly doing what I call human capital gain because, you know, I I I started out as an academic actually and I I believe in education. I believe in in free teaching. But coming back the the um the basic issue the crypto economy topped out because these transactions um like when you're doing a swap a swap a trust swap it's with a
56:20stranger. Okay. It's like all right go away you know and never talking to them again. Right? When you do a trade on an exchange you don't even know who your counterparty is. You you do a market sell and it's like seven random counterparties at Coinbase or whatever is handling the the thing for you. Don't do market sells by the way. They do limit orders. You know what I mean, right?
56:37Um, so, so point being that, uh, the real economy is more than just swap and then never see you again, right? Any company, any project like even good morning forecast or something like that. That's a trust relationship between, you know, Nish and Adrien that you've had over years. And because you have trust, not everything can be put in a contract, right? Look, I love contracts. I love so my view is crypto was able to tell us
57:04what is legally permissible like deterministic 01 now with AI moderation we can say what is morally desirable okay like a propolistic kind of thing like shades of gray so now you can actually have civility now why do I say morally desirable immediately that'll get people's hackles up they'll say oh my god bali who are you to say what morality is oh my god you're such a preacher dictator blah blah blah Okay.
57:30So, first of all on that he's been listening to some of the things that have been said. All right.
57:34Oh well that's like the thing is you have to have a budget for like you know Singapore did not become Singapore because Lee Kuan you wanted to be liked by everybody at all times right no nothing like Elon like nothing you do if you try to optimize for constantly being liked what'll happen is you actually get hated by everybody at the end because the thing goes to zero right I'll come back to that point in a second TLDDR by the way without me taking over forecaster is going to go to zero it it was basically think of it as what's called you know what a recap round is
58:06Yeah. Recap. So, you're talking about when um you have somebody coming in the you're you're um losing money essentially. The company's losing money, they come back in, the investors recap, but and everyone's um valuation goes down. So, you're coming in with that like kind of situation. Yeah, that's right. Basically, look, there were there were several experiments that were run um over Farcasters history in what the thing should be. And to be clear,
58:34full respect to Dan and Rich because it's really difficult being an entrepreneur and so but they themselves would agree that those experiments didn't work out and on net they didn't create like numbers money is not the only thing but right there is no forecast or community there's a user base right why is well I think it also I think some and some people may not realize that like actually I should say there's a community but it's buried under stuff and it needs to be like like that stuff has to be scraped away and so on go
59:01ahead when DWR and and uh V started Farcaster, Elon didn't own Twitter.
59:08And also there was no threads. There was no blue sky. There was it was a very different environment. So their goal was different from where we are now because the whole the whole, you know, everything was different. So there's it's a very different you're you're looking at a different world at where we are now. So when that all shifted, of course it makes it much more difficult to accomplish bringing a billion people online to a a small social network that
59:37runs on crypto rails.
59:39So that's the thing.
59:40One of So that's another key point and I'll come back to some other points.
59:44Um I don't believe the world needs another social network, another crypto trading app or even another uncensorable anything. Why those exist in abundance?
59:52Okay. like whatever level of if you want 4chan or blue sky those exist okay you can have the far right or far-left community of your dreams okay it's there already exists you can scream obscenities on the internet in many many places okay unfortunately you can have you know there's all the stuff that exists in abundance social networks exist in abundance crypto trading exists in abundance okay
1:00:20and with things like bithat And there's quite a you know there's quite a few projects nowadays that have leaned all the way into censorship resistant you know so on and so forth right and you know what like against like a uh against the Soviet Union against what China many people fear is and what many people fear China could become right um you will need something like that okay because against a very sophisticated you know technotyrant you do want freedom but the
1:00:49the thing is that you can't just be oppositional defiant all the time. Just that like the Soviet Union being bad doesn't mean that Singapore is also bad.
1:00:58Okay, a state being bad. It's like saying this man was bad, therefore all men are bad. This woman was bad, therefore all women are bad. You you have to be able to make distinctions, right? So the tool that you use to resist tyranny is different than the tools that we use to rebuild from anarchy. Okay? And so like keeping in mind that both things can be bad and you actually want civilization which is neither anarchy nor tyranny nor a narcoy. So San Francisco for example is a narcoy. Why? Um you have an Uber
1:01:26driver and his window is smashed by a mentally ill drug addict. That's the anarchy. And then he's fined whatever $100 because his car is parked you know a few you know like on the street right? So he is simultaneously subject to predation from crazy people that the state doesn't enforce on, but the state does enforce on the law-abiding, right? And so that's that's that's a that's the worst of all, right? That's the opposite of civilization. That's decelization, right? And you see that in LA. You see
1:01:56that in San Francisco. You see that unfortunately in way too many places in the West, right? You see in large parts of London. Um, and often that's a pinser attack against the middle who is neither sympathetic enough to be more sympathetic than the homeless mentally ill drug addict, right? Nor powerful enough to actually resist the state.
1:02:12That's a kind of person who's like pinser attack. And I don't think, you know, the only escape out of that is to make so much money that you can escape from that. Okay.
1:02:21Now, you know, one thing I I I know I'm digressing, but I'll permit me. Okay.
1:02:27Yeah. I was we always we always learn something from you when you digress and like like reading your posts are are like our own little library which I enjoy.
1:02:37Well, thank you. I I try to include at least I try to include my thought process and welcome reason critique. Um but basically I was a career academic. I never wanted to be a CEO, never wanted to be a found. That was never my ambition in life. Never my ambition growing up. All I wanted to know were more true things. Okay. And the only reason I actually even got into tech is that when with genome sequencing, so I started my career in biio medicine. Um,
1:03:05if you did like a, you know, if every genome you sequenced cost $1,000. It costs less than that today. It costs more than that back then. But then to sequence a million genomes, a thousand genomes would cost you a million dollars. But if you made a $100 per genome, now you could actually get 10,000 100,000 genomes. So you could get more data if you made a profit. So more data means better insight into the nature of disease, more truth. So you actually needed capitalism to get to scale, to get more data, to get more truth. Same kind of thing that they're seeing in AI, same kind of thing in
1:03:34other spaces. That's actually what led me to like at age 30, I had zero dollars in my bank account.
1:03:41Okay? I've never been a money motivated person. I woke up every day for years and just said like and just meditated on mathematics. That's like what I did. And to be clear, like I'm not Terrence Tao or, you know, I'm I'm okay at math. I'm good enough to like, you know, teach at Stanford or what, but um but there's always better.
1:04:00It's pretty good, but but it's like it's like being like, I don't know, 70 at the Olympics or something like that, you know? You're it's I'm nowhere close to the medal section. There's guys who are way way better, right? But I'm at the Olympics. I'm at the Olympics.
1:04:13Yeah, that's true. Okay. Fine. Fine. But but my my my my point is that uh what I what I really prized was the environment of Stanford in the late 90s and the early 2000s. It was sunny. I also liked in many ways the middle classish upbringing that I had and you weren't actually you didn't have to spend I mean okay yeah Stanford was expensive but the middle classish upbringing wasn't that expensive right like that was accessible to a lot of people.
1:04:41It was accessible. Yeah. I I think civility is free and like just to be civil to somebody else, to be courteous, to be polite, to be respectful, to open a door for an old lady or to, you know, give up your seat for a pregnant woman on the subway or, you know, to smile at a little child or something like that costs absolutely nothing and makes everybody's day better. And we need that not just offline, but we need that online. And the only way I can explain
1:05:10that to certain crypto degens is this very baroque kind of thing which I wrote up which is because they're like why should I be polite to anybody? Haha.
1:05:18Should we want, you know, to just be able to say f you to everybody, right?
1:05:21And we what we want on the new far caster is thank you culture, not blank culture.
1:05:28Okay? Like back to GM, okay? In a sense, right? And the thing is now, you know, the way somebody will uh critique this, they'll say, "Oh, what bal you're saying be polite or else?"
1:05:40And kind of, yes, I'm saying be polite or else find another client. Okay? Be polite or else. Yes. If you know the problem is small town America, as much as I love small town America, a lot of great things with small town America, it's small town America.
1:05:58Go ahead. You saw my note on that, right?
1:06:00Small town America doesn't scale. Yeah.
1:06:02Doesn't scale. And because it doesn't scale, it doesn't have the markets or the internationalism of the big city, right? And this has always been the tension where people understand like it's just like putting your finger on that like literally in the name right there is small town America. Smalltown America's norms only work at this maybe Dunbar or 10x Dunar size like 150 1500 I don't know the exact number but that there's a certain point where it works in an implicit way and then it breaks
1:06:30down when you get to a certain scale. Why does it break down? By the way, I can give a mathematical argument.
1:06:35If you have two people and let's say you're playing a game where each person can win or lose. Okay? So you could have four outcomes. Win-win, win- lose, lose win, lose lose. Okay? Two squared, right? Because you could have a win-win game where they both win. You could have a win- lose game where one guy knocks other out or vice versa. Lose win. Or you could have lose lose where they both punch each other and they're both bloody at the end of it, which actually what most fights end up as actually. They're most lose-lose, right? Russia, Ukraine, lose- lose. Everybody loses. Millions of
1:07:04people die, right? Lots of people get into fights thinking it's going to be win- lose and they end up with lose-lose.
1:07:10Okay, that's almost all wars. Almost almost all wars are like this. Everybody, you know, like everybody thinks other guys just going to roll over, right? This is why I'm very anti-war except as a last last resort.
1:07:22This is one of the biggest things I differ with some of my friends on is I understand how they got this way, but there's a glorification of violence and so on, which I think is, you know, what we really want is more peace in the world, not more violence. I understand how they got their way, but I think we need more peace. So, I'll come back to that. Okay. So, once you have three people in that same game, now you have two to third possibilities. Win win, win, win, lose, win, lose, win, right?
1:07:46Lose win and so on. So, you have, you know, basically eight possibilities. Once you have four people, you can have win win, lose, lose, lose, lose, and 14 other combinations. So, 16 to the fourth, right? And once you have n people, you have two to the n possible combinations. This is what's called a hyper cube in in n dimensional space.
1:08:05Why is that important? Let's say you have a startup with with 50 or 100 people there. Let's say you have 100.
1:08:11You have two to the hundred possible outcomes. But what you need to do is you need to have the coordinate where everybody wins together be the biggest payoff for everybody. Otherwise, 51 people could see, hey, if we conspire against the other 49, maybe we could take the treasury and take it for ourselves, and then we play a win-win win-win-win game. But the other guys get lose lose lose. This is what happens with Dows where you have like a Yes, it does.
1:08:37Right. So, some subgroup says, "Hey, why don't we loot the treasury?" Okay. And conspire and rig the vote or whatever and loot the treasury. And so the way that uh and then that often ends in loose lose- lose where everybody you know the whole thing breaks down. Right.
1:08:53So the way that this is Okay, great. You you know you've seen that phenomena.
1:08:57I've seen it firsthand in nouns and other Dows like firsthand with that's exactly where it's not where you started but it is where you ended because because of that kind of thinking of there all it takes is one. It only takes that one person to have that like, well, I'm going to win and you guys can lose and I'll get enough people on my side and there, you know, that's all it takes. And and depending on the DAO, sometimes it's very easy to do that capture.
1:09:22And sometimes it's harder.
1:09:24This is what VCs when they talk about alignment, right? They mean alignment in like the vector sense of I win and you win and they win all at the same time.
1:09:34Right. So your win is my win is her win is his win all at the same time. Okay, that means the upper right corner of the hyper cube is where everybody wins together. That's why equity exists.
1:09:47That's why a coin exists, right? Number go up means everybody's fortunes rise together. Number go down means everybody's fortunes fall together. This way they they aren't thinking as much about offdagonal conspiracies where 70% can attack the 30% or or what have you. Okay, now that works so long as you're in growth stage and you've got a number there. Okay, that's why companies work.
1:10:11That's why cryptocurrencies in the growth stage can work. Now, Farcaster without a coin and also without Singaporean morray broke down once there wasn't enough like basically if you think about it started out here's my analysis of it right and you may disagree but right it started out as Dan's friends and friends of friends which was an awesome community basically like basically my friends there and you could have a highle discussion where everybody knew each
1:10:39other or knew each other offline or their friends offline so they were super polite and they understood that certain things just don't have to be discussed in public. Okay? Meaning this is a thing like a lot of unfortunately the 20somes they've gotten all the wrong lessons from the 60somes. Okay, the 60 and 70somes leaders Republicans and Democrats are cursing at each other on X. This was unheard of even 20 years ago. By the way, Google, you know, the FCC broadcast standards.
1:11:09Here's here's Okay, I'm gonna give you guys a link. Can you which which those those are those are being ignored a lot too.
1:11:16Well, so I mean you're like a law prof, aren't you? No.
1:11:18Yeah. Yeah, you are. Okay. Can you put something on screen?
1:11:22I want to show something.
1:11:23Do you There is a private chat if you want to drop the link. I can pull it up from there or you can send it somewhere else.
1:11:29Yeah. Let me grab See if I can Hold on.
1:11:34If you text it, I can also prof it.
1:11:36Yeah. Yeah. Let me see if Okay. Yeah. Do that. Just make it easier.
1:11:40Yeah. just send it if you can send it through signal and then she'll she'll grab it.
1:11:43And bal those early days actually early early days I think probably first year of Farcaster was primarily Dan's network but when Prof and I joined pre-permissionless and it wasn't I mean Dan used to say this all the time like all the people who grew on Farcaster weren't people he knew in person right but we were drawn for the mission to that vibe.
1:12:04Yeah. not for airdrops, not for promise of anything and there was like very okay I got it. Um and it was also where you values like it was you had shared trust um immediate oh and it was also again it's I think the other thing that people forget is that it was during that time where Elon didn't you know it was still Jack Dorsey's Twitter right it was no threads no blue sky no none of that so there was very few um textonly
1:12:34type of platforms so it was just a different moment where that made sense to be building trying that experiment trying to push for that. It made sense at that time and then it just made less sense as other competitors who could scale quickly. You know when when Zuckerberg goes in and says we're going to connect threads to every Instagram account which already has you know a bazillion users it becomes a whole
1:13:04different ballgame.
1:13:05So you just you just you know scale it to a different point. Um, okay. Let me bring this up. One second.
1:13:13So, let's let's bring up those links.
1:13:15What I want to do is I want to re I want to re-anchor people on what they A lot of people have had their minds wiped by. Um, so yes, there we go. Right. Actually, show the first one. Actually, show show the show the second link I sent you, the fc.gov one.
1:13:32Hold on. I didn't hold on. I got to She didn't send that one to me.
1:13:37I didn't see I didn't see it. Hold on.
1:13:39Yeah. Hold on one second.
1:13:42But yes, they um there was a whole different I and I think this this is partly, you know, age related for us because we remember a time where there were You're very young women.
1:13:54Three networks. I'm really not. Uh I grew up in a time where there were three networks, no cable. uh when I'm you know in my youth youth when I'm a kid and then you get um you know into cable changing that environment. So I know exactly where you're where you're going with this. Um and we still see this but only to a point because a lot of the speech cannot be um censored in this way because of the change in the
1:14:24way things work where you have streaming where you have the internet. So I grew up in a pre- internet world.
1:14:30That's right. So I want to I want to put a finger on this. Obscene, indecent, and profane broadcast. Okay. Right.
1:14:37So meaning you could not in the lives of most Americans like over the age of 25 something, right? Like basically obscene, indecent, and profane content could not be broadcast on TV, on radio. Like that's why the news times even had the thing all the news that's fit to print.
1:15:01Right. There was a you know I know when I see like Yeah. This was I was highlighting that because this is this is one of these um you know cases that you study in law school.
1:15:12Yes. You know it's and we talk about this. Yeah. Because it's very Justice Potter.
1:15:17Yeah. Go ahead. What Potter Stewart was saying, translated 63 years later, is I need AI to make probabilistic judgments of what is actually profane, obscene, and indecent. I know it when I see it because I've been trained on whatever number of examples to distinguish good from bad. Now what Potter was saying at the time was only a human can make such judgments but the fact that it's hard to like because people will give him edge
1:15:46cases like oh right is uh is Michelangelo you know is that pornography or something like that right and they'll always get come with some edge cases and saying hard cases make bad law right the now it is true that you need to class as edge cases but there's a civilization and cultural context where that's not actually obscene right it's sculpture fine But it's also not saying you're going to press a kid's face into it or something like that. You know what I mean? You're gonna there's there's a context to all of this kind of stuff. The point is
1:16:15people will bring up these edge cases, but that the bulk can actually be dealt with. And guess what? It can be dealt with very easily today with AI classifiers. Very easily, cheaply. That's a new thing.
1:16:27So, we're going to have FCC broadcast standards on Farcaster.
1:16:32Wow. Okay. And you and you know what?
1:16:34That was a better America. That was a better America. That was an America where people were not at each other's throats. They were not cursing and screaming at each other. In fact, by the way, even the concept of being able to get online and not, by the way, these people, they're not simply typing into a text box. They're they're doing the equivalent of screaming in your digital face.
1:16:52So, it's not just freedom of speech like they can yell into the void. It's freedom of attack. The other they want the other person to be there on the same platform as them so they can yell at that person. this person's rights are not being considered in the situation where this person should be free from attack. It's not simply to be able to block them because they can summon all these other people to attack that person. Right? A platform where you have freedom from attack is actually very valuable because now you can be about your business without having to
1:17:22constantly defend yourself at all times. Right now look um you know if you're in tech you know people like oh you don't have to look I I can argue online. I can do but do I want to do that all day? I don't really want to do that. I want want to build. Right. Okay.
1:17:34That's why a lot of people came over to Farcaster early days was they were tired of arguing online. And I think that that kind of got lost a little bit.
1:17:44And the other thing that I've seen is people leave Farcaster because of that shift and you know who were getting attacked and were like I don't I don't want to spend my day like this. So I'm out.
1:17:56That's right. And we lost some valuable people who were very interesting and good contributors because of that.
1:18:02That's right. That's right. And now if you look at the other link I sent the law. One.
1:18:07Yep. Let me bring that up.
1:18:14Haven't been on this for a while. Used to use this a lot. Um, so this is the 18 USC 1464 broadcasting obscene language.
1:18:24That's right. Now here's guess what am I throwing anybody in jail for two years? No.
1:18:30But retroact guess what this is actually US code. All right. Guess getting off easy. Getting off easy. Okay. So point being, right? And of course I'm kidding.
1:18:41All right. Right. But there's a truth here which is literally broadcasting obscene language within the lives of those people now living was something that could lead to more than two years imprisonment. Okay. But or really it meant that you know usually it was a fine. Usually usually it was a fine usually fine. But the point is that it could it was it was something that had teeth and it was punished. Right.
1:19:03Now there's a if you put that back on screen though.
1:19:04It still is. It actually still is for broadcast for broadcast um channels but there's but nobody watches broadcast channels.
1:19:14So lied. So CBS you know those ones NBC CBS ABC that still occasionally happens. And you know, Saturday Night Live famously tends to be the one because it's live and because that is a little edgier that occasionally get still gets hit with fines. So it still happens.
1:19:33This is basically something where the you're right, the fines sometimes happen. But here's the thing is um the words here are very important because broadcast just means going out to a large group of people, right? It has however the critical word on this page is radio communication right okay so what happened as you know but maybe the audience hasn't the internet got an exception right in the late 90s um on the the uh from
1:20:02the communications decency act was trying to basically quote censor the internet and it got an exception because the premise was hey you know it's not going to be like with radio or television some kid could walk around and hear this you have to go and seek things out on the internet. It's a computer nerds kind of thing and so forth.
1:20:20And so then what happened of course is the internet grew exponentially to such an extent that obviously there's far more viewership of YouTube and X and obviously a kid happens across I mean it's more likely they're going to happen across something on a phone or a screen than they are in a TV these days, right? So the new broadcast is it's a live stream. It's X. That's obviously the public square. So what happened was this thing that was supposed to be a computer nerd exception
1:20:50became the public square and that exception where profane obscene etc indecent language was allowed in the computer nerd sector became the rule right that is how our public culture got radically coarssened in the English language sphere but that's and the reason I point this out is many people be like oh it's so unamerican to have any restrictions on speech speech whatsoever. I'm like, "Oh, yeah. And when was America created?"
1:21:19Well, yeah. We've always had time, man, or place exceptions to free speech.
1:21:24Well, exactly. But the thing is that uh they'll say, "When was America great?"
1:21:28I'm like, in different ways. They'll say, "Oh, it was it was better in, you know, 1945 or was better in this." And I'm like, "Guess what?
1:21:35Broadcasting of language wasn't allowed." To be clear, this is it's not monofactorial. There's many different factors. There's China disrupting the Republicans and taking over manufacturing and military strength. The internet disrupted the Democrats in many ways, taking over media and monetary strength. And I'm sure someone will be like, "Oh, Bali, you cursed once on some broadcast or whatever." Absolutely true. I'm sure I'm sure I've done that, though I don't I try not to do it very much.
1:21:57Okay. Point is that um and we also have like an appeals process and so it's not really about cursing really. That's not that's like the smallest thing. It's about like hostility against another human being, right? which is sometimes cursing, but it's actually easily detectable with AI, right? That's a great thing. It's not just one post.
1:22:15It's a pattern. That person is being muted and blocked by lots of other people. They're just like a crazy person, an angry person who comes online to vent their spleen at others. Okay?
1:22:25And that it's been rewarded. It's been rewarded.
1:22:28It's been rewarded. So that was the thing is that you you have this reward for engagement and that's why we see things like rage baiting where people are specifically looking for that reaction because they know it'll get views engagement and they earn then they earn from that like they're earning monetarily so that just kind of continues on like that. So that's that's definitely been an issue on most social media platforms. So
1:22:57I want to show you I want to show you something else also which I just sent to Adrian. Maybe you can bring it up on screen.
1:23:03So I I I just quoted US law right on what was acceptable. Okay.
1:23:10And now let's take a look at the Farcaster terms of service and community guidelines that every single user. So that's the terms of use. Okay. And scroll down. Okay. Click the community guidelines. It's the head of the second section that right there by use agree your green community guidelines. So everybody signed on to this. This was look at that. Zero tolerance for abusive users or harassment. Zero tolerance for hate speech. No posting illegal content.
1:23:37Every single part of the new network code is basically just an AI enforced version of this human thing which there weren't the resources to enforce this across millions of posts.
1:23:49Okay. Yeah. And literally we have a table that's coming that just we're just going to post that just shows everything and how it maps back to that. Okay. The only exception is profanity. That's an infraction. That's just something where it's become such a sewer online on this that we we want we want to tamp back on it. But let me just double click on something you just said. So you are going to be making public sort of the infractions or the wrap sheets.
1:24:14We already did that folks. Well, so actually make it available.
1:24:18Okay. The code is the code is now available and easy to find. Like it was already public, but it now it's easy to find. It's on the navigation bar right at the top.
1:24:26But are like I if I want to see okay, where did you know I I I wasn't in the red zone. I wasn't banned, but I'm sure I've made infractions and I want to see what I may have done. Um is that going to be made public to everybody?
1:24:40It it will be made visible to you.
1:24:43Okay. And then we will we have to decide like on the one hand it's a synthesis of public data and so on and so forth but it'll probably be made visible to you or not it will be made visible to you and the goal of this one thing we've already got a graph showing that profanity has crashed on the network. Guess what? Code of conduct is law now, right? It's not just code is law. Code of conduct is law. That was a missing piece, right? We to have a crypto economy. Like you just as a thought experiment, okay? You're
1:25:10walking down the street. Imagine like somebody comes up and just starts screaming at you and saying, "I hate you because of you know your your X or Y or Z." They'll attack you for your race, your class, I don't know, your hair, whatever. Who knows? Okay. This is a common experience for many people in San Francisco, by the way. Deranged people running up to you on the street. Okay, it happens in many.
1:25:31But now, now assume they've actually got a crowd of hangers on. They're doing the equivalent of like, thumbs up. You know, you could actually make a meme of this. All right, imagine that in the physical world.
1:25:40First of all, that's a crazy situation in the physical world. You can call 911. Okay? Right?
1:25:46There's a police that will come and fix.
1:25:47That's like not legal to do in the physical world. That's like that's that is harassment. That's abuse. That's threats. There's there's various kinds of crimes around that. They've been less enforced recently because there's so much more tolerance for insane behavior in the physical world. That's supposed to be a crime. You're not supposed to menace someone or threaten them or whatever. Second is are you going to do business in that jurisdiction, right?
1:26:10No. Obviously, like someone coming up to you, if it's a common thing that happens all the time, of course not. Yeah. That's not where you want to be, right?
1:26:17Or if if that is something which is permitted, then clearly other laws aren't enforced. that if if you don't have even security rights, you know, some complex matter of property rights.
1:26:27If the state won't protect you when some crazy person could attack you, it's definitely not going to protect you in some abstract, you know, like genuinely that's not a hard question of jurist prudence or or justice or whatever. Like obviously you're the innocent and they're the guilty. If the state can't figure that out, it definitely won't be able to figure out some more complicated matter. I'm not saying that anybody who's threatened in this way will have all those calculations go through their head, but fundamentally be like, you know what, this is an unsafe area. I'm going to take my business somewhere else, right? Even if it's not just pure capitalism, obviously you're not
1:26:56thinking capitalism all the time. The point is that from an economic standpoint as well as a social standpoint, that area just becomes a ghost area of broken windows and people just staying far away from it, a bad part of town. Okay. So, if we know that that happens in the physical world, that's also what happens in the digital world, right? If you're walking down the street doing your digital business and some crazy person who is obsessing about you online who you've never met, who has a parasocial relationship comes up and
1:27:25starts screaming obscenities at you, yelling about uh like, you know, I really don't care if someone wants to kill me for my class, oh my god, you're a capitalist. Or my race, oh my god, you're Indian. Yes, I'm an Indian and I'm a capitalist. I'm, you know, yeah, wow, amazing. You figured these things out, right? I don't care if the threats are coming from the far left or the far right. I just don't care. I just think that often, by the way, they're not even really ideological. These are just like insane people or people who were sane
1:27:54and became less sane who've latched on to these ideologies as like a way of explaining why their life has gotten worse. They want to scapegoat somebody else rather than assign it to these impersonal systemic factors of like the decline of the American empire and the rise of the internet and the return of Asia and the shift of the world economy.
1:28:11All those kinds of things are why their lives have gotten worse versus like one clear human being that they can scapegoat. They want to scapegoat like the best group for them people to scapegoat unfortunately is uh the immigrant technologist where the right can get mad because they're immigrants and the left can get mad because they're technologists. That's why part of the reason I'm 10,000 miles away, right?
1:28:31Because I can see that coming.
1:28:33Yeah, it's safer. That's right. Like basically, you know, being in a country that has Right. On the other hand, I also like many obviously of my American friends and all the people there, I don't think they fully understand how bad it's going to get. And what we want to do is a develop a zone of in-person civil online and the corresponding thing offline, right? Show that that's possible to have that bridge between the two, which is what the old Farcastaster in
1:29:03some ways used to be, but now we have the more scalable version. Okay.
1:29:06B, then allow anybody else to take that playbook and have their own startup society, right? And that's by the way how we scaled the number of validator nodes.
1:29:16Okay. Because if you've seen, have you seen the network state conference? Can you bring that on screen? ns.com conference.
1:29:35Oops. Is it ns.comconference?
1:29:38Yes, ns.comconference.
1:29:41Why is it not coming up for me?
1:29:50Yeah, I'm getting Oh, there it is. Okay, hold on.
1:30:00So, this was this is the recent one.
1:30:04Recent one, but just scroll down.
1:30:08And just keep going.
1:30:10So, 2025. So if you look at the names on this right these are basically and maybe you can scroll down a little bit further the speakers is that where speakers yeah so we have we have a lot of obviously you know top crypto guys especially we also have a lot of if you go down further you'll see a lot of uh click seem more you'll see lots of startup society founders okay y and um the thing about this is um and that's always been a section so we've I know that Adrian and I have both
1:30:39watched um all the different conferences and that's always been a big section of what you've done at the conference is to share the different startup societies have them come on and talk about what they're building some of them like city ed all these different people and they really do span the ideological spectrum okay basically the only people who aren't there are are what I consider ultra institutional we know this guy we know this guy
1:31:06oh great yeah great exactly that's right and by the way we have people there who are uh basically pro and con almost any issue you can imagine. What they have in common is civility and they want to uh build new societies and they want to build the answer to their problems rather than scapegoating somewhere else. Right. Right. They don't want to scapegoat the capitalists or immigrants or whatever. Um right.
1:31:30And the point is that uh again I'm not saying this this group if you scroll down further go a little bit further. Y so like you know so the thing is John Hillis you know did cabin and so it's so some of these projects work some of these projects didn't work but the the point you know there's Veronica with zoo village and you know vibe cam so anyway point is this um many of these startup societies have physical properties and private cloud is now getting good
1:31:59enough that you can just set up some servers anywhere in a closet okay and one idea and I think this which is a likely future is we have 10 maybe eventually a hundred star societies that are each validator nodes. Okay. And Farcaster is a community of communities, a United Networks like United Nations. To be clear, by the way, the United Nations still has a concept of a rogue state. Okay. Something that is out.
1:32:29Yeah. So this network of the internet, you know, tracking star societies globally, right? Okay. Great. This is a great um and I'll include this particular um we'll include both of these sites in the show notes so folks can go check these out and I'll give you a visual also but this is really this to me is really interesting this dashboard really kind of gives you um a lot of information about startup societies sort of all over the place and many of these people many of the founders are going to come on to Farcaster and we're going to make
1:32:56Farcaster into a platform for basically finding founding funding starting that's me okay I was like, "That's you." I'm like, "What happened?"
1:33:05I'm sharing something, but I'm putting trying to put this back on.
1:33:08I wanted to put that put that. Okay. So, this is a graph that we've made.
1:33:11I was just making sure that I was like, where did that come from? Who's who's hacking my I didn't realize it would put it right on stage when I shared.
1:33:18That's fine. So, here we are. So, this this one is uh so this is not final final, but this is an intermediate analysis. We're probably going to publish this. Um, so this is our graphic, okay? Just analyzing the millions of tweets. And you can see, you know, if you if you say friend speech is positive some behavior and foe speech is negative some behavior. This captures quantitatively again with AI we can make we can say things that we all know to be true but we can put numbers on it so people can't gaslight. They can't say oh well I said good morning to someone
1:33:48yesterday the fire caster spirit is alive and well. No, actually when you go up more than 10x from less than 2% negativity to 20 30%. It's it's basically the San Franciscoization of Farcaster where you had a bunch of tech people and then you had a bunch of crazy people there because tech people can get exploited by a certain kind of person who will quote certain things of them as freedom back at them and then you you suddenly are victimized or you're
1:34:16attacked on the street by like a drug addict or something like that, right?
1:34:20And women are unsafe and so on. So that's ahead.
1:34:24Can I push back on one thing?
1:34:26So the the way you're kind of the the narrative and and I think there were crazy people for for sure and we and we saw them. I think there's also a whole lot of people that we were friends with that we shared a lot of online time with um that did not that kind of got banned from from speech. And I think a lot of them are not necessarily crazy. I think they were just trained and learned how to behave on social because of
1:34:55the way the world has kind of progressed with like, oh, I'm on social media, therefore anything I think immediately gets broadcast. So, I just it's not that I'm disagreeing with the conclusion or vision, but I think there's maybe the reasoning behind it.
1:35:12They're not crazy people. They're just behaving the way this is the way society has kind of grown.
1:35:19Yeah, you're you're absolutely correct and actually uh let me offer finer gradations. Okay, because you're completely correct because basically the thing is often any one sentence is almost necessarily an oversimplification. One sentence cannot contain the world entire you know you but but to to to clarify or to add add some more uh second third and fourth order terms. So you do have actually generally crazy impulse unconstrained people who are yelling profanities and so on right
1:35:47and then you have people who saw that that behavior was rewarded right that by the algorithm right conflict you know the saying if it bleeds it leads right right right and so like you don't actually have to have somebody bleed but fight fight you know uh that like basically a there's a reason that movies have conflict and that's exciting and dramatic in a movie but you don't actually want your life to quote be a movie because that's like burning buildings and things shooting
1:36:16and so on. Especially if you have children or if you have family and something you want your life to be stable. Okay. So, so one is actually crazy people, then people who fell in with a bad crowd or they were algorithmically incentivized and they just follow incentives and then there's an interesting group where uh so the thing about like one group is doing wrong. The second group is doing wrong but knows they're doing wrong on some level. Okay. Then there's a third group
1:36:45which denies that wrong can even be done.
1:36:49This is a Fukaldian kind of group. Okay, you know Michelle Fuko. Okay, the Michelle Fuko. Okay, Michelle Fuko is the most All right. So if you go and look at the most cited academics, right? Actually, let me let me say something. When when you hold up your phone or something like that, you have all the libraries there and you can tell if you want to who authored the software that went into your phone and often go back to GitHub and find the exact people that wrote the software that you use every day, right?
1:37:14So you know that there was someone who wrote that software that you use every day even if you're not thinking about them. In the same way the software in your head, the wetwware in your head was also crafted by somebody. Okay? Often very intentionally to mimemetically propagate. If you've ever worked on a marketing campaign, you know that people optimize mimemetic punch through and jingles and so on and so forth to be catchy and whatnot. The same is true for many ideas that you have consciously or unconsciously absorbed, including myself. Everybody has.
1:37:42And one of them is Michelle Fuko. Okay, Michelle Fuko is a French philosopher who pioneered something called deconstructionism. And very roughly, this is the art of saying, "Oh, I know you think being family friendly is good, but actually let me explain to you why that's bad and actually a revolt against all authority is actually true good." Haha, I'm so sophisticated. Right now, Fuko himself was literally a pedophile.
1:38:09Okay, not right. And so his justification for essentially overturning all traditional morality was to open a door such that when others were confused and couldn't distinguish between good and evil, well, they couldn't distinguish that even what he was doing was evil. You see what I'm saying? Right? It's like let all the criminals out of Arkham Asylum and then he can blend in among them. All right?
1:38:27So in this we can deconstruct deconstructionism itself.
1:38:31You see my point, right? Bang. We got them. Right, ladies and gentlemen? We got him. And so this is actually it's it's it's similar to how like a virus enters the cell. It actually fains looking like something the cell might normally let in and then it hijacks a cell to replicate itself and so on and so forth, right? So, um, a good chunk of people can be can kind of catch themselves up in this kind of deconstructionists type of thing and they can convince themselves that good
1:39:01and evil don't exist and that wrong can't even be done while they're sipping their coffee in a cafe. But that entire cafe only exists because of a huge supply chain of people who do abide by the law, who do ship things on time, wake up in the morning, pack the, you know, truck, you know, like get the coffee beans. There's a huge supply chain of people that actually do need to believe that like right and wrong exists. They're not like stealing the the coffee beans and so on and so forth, right? Only that person, that academic at the apex who's been corrupted by
1:39:29foldism um can can actually think that right and wrong don't exist.
1:39:33Unfortunately, the faculty lounges corruption of speech and thought and deed has gone metastatic gone super viral with uh with the with with the internet with with Twitter. Like the reason is I I said I came up in the faculty lounge. A lot of these things that you'll hear like toxic masculinity, white privilege, mansplaining, they're all essentially like mobile optimized versions of academic PhD thesis that were meant to be verbal shavs to win battles in the faculty lounge. Now Prof.
1:40:02you you know what I'm talking about.
1:40:03I do a little bit. Yeah, I know.
1:40:05Okay, fine. Okay. So, well, I think there's things that you talk about in a philosophical way that's more general and then you see what plays out in the real world. And those are two different things when you're having an academic discussion and theory and things like that doesn't necessarily play out exactly that way all the time.
1:40:24That's right. Like like that person will say, "Oh, does do good and evil even exist?" And you know, that's a whole different Yeah. That's a whole different like thought like thought game. You know what I mean?
1:40:33Yeah. And then then there then their cell phone is snatched or something and then they're immediately on the phone to the police who have a simplistic notion of good and evil. You know what I mean?
1:40:39Right now I'm not saying by the way that there aren't edge cases. I'm not saying that one doesn't sometimes think okay this was bad now it's actually good. I'm not saying that doesn't happen at times. Like for example let's say copyright law, trademark law. Those are areas where I think reasonable people can come up.
1:40:55Yeah. Go ahead. Oh that's my law.
1:40:57Fine. So like the whole thing about like 99year copyright and so and so forth. I I think you know I think that is a that that that is a distortion. I think that's a great example of something where we want to have a thousand different jurisdictions that can experiment with different kinds of things where certain aspects of the law are not black and white like that.
1:41:17Right? So again no sentence can contain the entire world. To say that fucoldianism is wrong doesn't mean that everything is clearly black and white either.
1:41:27Okay. So it means that yes shades of gray do exist. balance does exist but that doesn't mean that one can categorically reject the idea that wrong can even be done. So coming back to your point Adrian, this is my So A, there are genuinely crazy people with low impulse control. B, there's people who are algorithmically incentivized for intention and understood that fights gained attention and so on. C, there's those people who basically they they want to you know like this is the thing of it was funny is by the way there's there's always the concession that codes of conduct are good, written rules are
1:41:57good, that people had become too hostile and the only thing is people are like oh my god it was retroactive. It wasn't retroactive. You know why? Those th those those community guidelines already existed and this is just enforcement, right? Okay. Of of things that are already there and we can show the exact mapping. And two, look at the FCC's guidelines. Like basically culturally all this stuff existed. And so and then third is just common sense says do you need to have a law that says hey you shouldn't go and scream at Mark
1:42:26Anderson or or or anybody frankly on the internet, right? Do do you have to have a law that says that? Does it need to be taught to you? And and moreover, if if it does, if if Oh, I would I would I would do it. Uh I wouldn't have done it if I had known that there was a law against it, but I would do it if it was permissible to do it.
1:42:46Is that something that we you want in the community? I'm not sure we do, right? I'm not sure that's actually a community member. That's not even what like a community is about connectivity.
1:42:53It's about like, you know, two people being not just polite to each other, but interact with each other. That's why I hesitate to use the term Far Cash community. I think a Far Cash community did exist with Dan. I think it got corrupted. I think you can dust it off and reclaim some of it. We can never fully rewind the clock. We need to rebuild it with new fresh DNA. Okay. The new fresh DNA is going to be a lot of network schoolers and a lot of techno optimist. Let me pause there. More I can say.
1:43:16Hold on one second. What are we doing here?
1:43:17I don't know what happened.
1:43:18What are you doing here? One second.
1:43:21Can we pause one second? Yeah, sure.
1:43:23Um, let me I'm gonna take him off screen real quick. Whoops. Let me remove Yeah. Oops. You did the same thing I did.
1:43:33We clicked the same buttons. Okay.
1:43:35Oh, I'm sorry. You're doing the same.
1:43:37Um, so he's I don't know. Not sure what happened if he went offline, but um, some of the things I want to get some clarity on when he comes back on and just kind of sum up what he's saying is that we did have I think this was a really good point around the um, let me pull up the code again.
1:43:59the terms of use that we haven't um really touched on that these terms of use existed prebiology um oops I bring this back up uh and that wasn't really enforced and I think we have come to the acceptance of like these things exist we click yes and don't really think about them and I actually talk about
1:44:28this in class in one of my law classes about terms of use that a lot of people don't realize um that these things exist. They don't pay attention to them. They just click yes because they want to get on and they don't really pay attention to what they mean. Um oh, I think he's back.
1:44:44Yeah, let me bring him back up. Oops. Hold on. Let's bring him back up to the stage. Oh, we don't hear you though.
1:44:54Okay, great. Just our SD card ran out of memory. Okay. Ah, okay. It's like what happened?
1:45:00Okay, let's continue.
1:45:02So, I was just I was just kind of like summing up a couple a couple points there um that I think are important to sort of put into the context of this new acquisition is that we did have, as you pointed out, there was a code of conduct that existed prior, you know, back to 2024. There were terms of use that already existed. They just weren't being heavily enforced. They were at times like you there were people who were what we called nerfed their accounts were not
1:45:32visible they were still visible on the protocol and essentially that's what you came in and did was sort of backpedal like not backpedal but backfill that sort of um thinking was that this you know the term technical debt yes yes yeah this is moderation debt yeah yeah so I can see that and also I think there's a feeling that you know I've seen this sort of u misnomer that half the half the protocol was banned
1:46:01like half the people and it was 26 271 people and of those 271 people almost 100 have actually I think more than 100 appealed we granted the super majority of those appeals and that 7% or something and that means like 180 people did not even want to appeal right and some fraction of them you know basically they had um different
1:46:29uh you know different like reasons for that but by the way some fraction of folks I mean one of the things that's really interesting about it is once you see the numbers you can see actually there's a small number of people it's actually a lot like crime like what you know like what El Salvador had where they had like on the order of 1% of the population were these face tattooed MS-13 gang members Right. And then there was a larger percentage of the population, still a
1:46:59small fraction, who while they themselves were not face tattooed MS-13 gang members, were sympathetic to them, right? They didn't feel that they should be, you know, jailed or removed or or something like that. But then the super mass mass majority of the site was very happy to have clean streets again, right? And so that's one way of thinking about it is there's a small fraction of people who were basically just inc I
1:47:27mean we're talking dozens in some cases more than a hundred uh bans or not blocks mutes and so on and so forth.
1:47:35Okay. by other people and oh, so that was taken into consideration if somebody absolutely had been blocked by a large number of people that was something that was especially relative to their follower count and especially mutes. The thing is um what does that suggest? That's actually a lot like a, you know, these these drug addicts will attack women in San Francisco, in LA, in Austin, and they'll
1:48:03they'll have 13, 14, 15 different things where they're picked up at the police station and let back out on the street, right? That means they've had a negative interaction with so many different people, but no centralized authority has done anything. Every person has to now resolve that this hostile, angry person, they're going to have to deal with them again, right? And again, this it's about like relative to the size of the following and so and so forth. Okay, so such a person is just aggressing against others. They're violating, if you want, the libertarian principle of
1:48:31non-aggression principle. Okay? And one of the great things about AI is you can tell who's starting the fights.
1:48:38Okay? It's not just, hey, did someone make an like because the problem is in the middle of a scrum like you one when one in defending oneself you you can have an angry comment or something like that but Yeah. Yeah.
1:48:51I know. I have. Yeah.
1:48:52That's right. But and the thing is you actually have to do that. You're put in this decivilized situation on social media where acts that would be completely you would never h I shouldn't say never.
1:49:03Unfortunately, we see this more and more as I said in these decivilized blue cities. But you usually offline are not in a situation where some random person is coming up to you and yelling obscenities in your face, right? and telling them how telling you how much they want to kill you, how bad a person you are, how evil you are, some random stranger you've never met. Okay, that's usually not the case in the physical world. It's quite frequent in the digital world. In such a case, one has to defend oneself, but it shouldn't have to be like that.
1:49:30We don't have to live like this, right?
1:49:32We should basic that kind of person who thinks it's their god-given right to run up to a stranger and scream in their face. There's no right to free screams, right?
1:49:41Right. Like you can type whatever you look and by the way I don't feel again the the 2026 internet 2026 social media is totally different than pre2022 absolutely pre20221 like I I would argue that the that the problem was tyranny okay now I'm not saying that tyranny doesn't exist I think like you know a complete unconstrained Chinese communist like China is a very complicated thing where like one or two sentences won't do it justice a lot of what they do works for
1:50:10some definition of work within China.
1:50:12But if you export it abroad, all the trade-offs that they've made within China go away and you just have the technology for total surveillance without any of the cultural, you know, nuances of how Chinese people, you know, deal with that. Um, so so I'm not saying that digital tyranny doesn't exist and that we I'm not saying we don't need those tech, but we also need technology to resist digital anarchy and that's a part which is completely underappreciated right now. Nobody wants to talk about that. On the other hand though once in a while you'll see
1:50:41somebody online saying you know what we really want is a high trust society again.
1:50:45You know what we really want is society where um you know basically there's like racial tolerance again religious tolerance again and so and so that's like the right will say high trust the left will say you know I wish we weren't in a time where when hate speech was so you know common and you know what I'm actually sympathetic to both of those.
1:51:04Okay. But I don't think that that can be forced upon left or right respectively because um I think you need to build a new jurisdiction over here and then you have to have a zone of civility and then you have to uh scale that and show that that works.
1:51:21I think there's a little bit that we can simplify as well. Yeah. And I because I think there's something that gets a little confused when we're talking about things like freedom of speech. Freedom of speech in terms of our constitution is talking about governmental restrictions, not private companies, not private individuals. So I think that gets kind of mixed up as well. So what I'm saying is if somebody comes in and buys Farcaster, they get to dictate the rules. And I think where some things got
1:51:51a little confused was if you came in and said, "Here are the terms of service.
1:51:56These have always been. We're going to enforce them. here's how we're enforcing them. It would have been a little different than taking a vote and I think that's where things got a little confused. So, can you talk a little bit about that choice and that decision?
1:52:10Absolutely. Absolutely.
1:52:11Because that would be helpful.
1:52:13Sure. Sure. Sure. So, the thing is that um you know only after you do something do you do you see exactly how people receive it and so on and so forth. Okay.
1:52:23Right. And um when you have a law or a rule that's been on the books for a long time but that hasn't been enforced, right? And then you increase the level of enforcement. How do you do that best? No matter how you do it, someone's going to complain.
1:52:44Now, the thing is every app has terms of service.
1:52:49Absolutely. which you're supposed to and it says if you don't agree with these terms of service, don't use it.
1:52:54Okay. But most software creators are not, for lack of a better term, courageous enough, determined enough to say, you know what, I'm going to lose whatever fraction of users that do not want to sign on to the new terms of service because I genuinely only want those people and I want it to actually be a signature as opposed to something that just, you know, like like so many things you just click through and say, "Blah, whatever. Who cares?
1:53:20Checkbox, click and go.
1:53:21Check box, click, ignore. Yeah.
1:53:23Whereas here, it's a genuine signature because this is the beginning of the social smart contract, right? There's going to be way more. By the way, any critiques when it has we will have other plebosites in the future. Okay. And essentially, it'll be something where um so let me also describe this is a draft draft draft draft non-binding. Okay? I'm just floating how I'm thinking about this now and may revisit this. But what
1:53:51I'd like to do is eventually open source everything. Okay, we've got the client out there and so on. Why? Well, first of all, that makes it more secure and so on, especially in this age of cyber apocalypse. Two is if it's open sourced, you can just go and host your own. Okay?
1:54:09Right? But if they're using in some direct or indirect way uh Farcaster or Niner like the Farcaster reference clients Niner architecture or even at the protocol level by the way like social is different than crypto right like pure crypto is just transactions.
1:54:27Social has images social has a lot of other stuff. Social in many ways has a larger attack surface right in many sense of the term. Um, and so can it be truly purely decentralized? I'm not sure it can be. Um, and moreover, there's a lot of guys who have actually done things that they think of as purely totally decentralized social. So instead, you have a validator set. Okay, that validator set may be all the people at these startup societies. It may be dozens of validators. I'd like to get
1:54:56there. I And there's a road map to that. By the way, that means the servers would not be sitting in EC2. They wouldn't be sitting in Amazon servers. They'd literally be sitting in whether it's Brazil, whether it's uh the UK, whether it's Japan, India, they're actually physical servers that are truly physically decentralized that are running validator nodes, right? That's actually something that's something of a holy grail.
1:55:17Yeah, that's the goal, right? So, it's it's genuinely decentralized in that sense, okay, where we have a bunch of different validators, but it is pro- civilized in another sense where all those people share technoptist values.
1:55:29It is a community of communities, okay?
1:55:32All the startup society founders fundamentally you know some of them might be Christian and some might be Muslim and some might be atheist and some might be Hindu and Buddhist and what have you right men women what have you all these different kinds of things um but they are fundamentally people who it's like the United Nations right it took a long time to get to something like that where we take it for granted that people from radically different cultures can put on suits and at least have a discussion there suits skirts whatever you know right and
1:56:01we want to get to that with the United Networks, right? So that's let's call it the hosted version of Farcaster because there's been a tension where I love Dan to be clear, not a criticism of Dan. I think it was a really good thing. Dan would say sufficiently decentralized and there's like a U curve of decentralization. Okay. Right.
1:56:18The U curve is either you're totally decentralized or you're totally hosted.
1:56:24Okay. And so open source is totally decentralized. It's out there. It's MIT or BSD licensed. Go get them. Okay. If you have some control, you basically have control. So I believe one should just embrace that and embrace the reality of it which is either it's open source MIT licensed and you can use it just don't use the name. Okay. Like for example, you know, don't use the name for because that causes brand confusion like people think we're hosting it or
1:56:52whatever. Okay. So open source over here full stack. go and run your own community of communities or if you're within our community of communities.
1:57:02Okay? And think of it as like you know again this would actually get you physical decentral it gets you a lot of the nice properties you want but it preserves civility because all of those validator nodes will reject uh you know various you know cam various kinds of illegal content malware and by the way we're going to have to get very aggressive about that because of the cyber apocalypse that's coming right those val nodes are going to need to be fairly cooperative because there's going to be all kinds of crazy attacks and so on to come okay right so
1:57:32so just to Just to recap, no matter how you increase enforcement after things that were on the books weren't enforced, people are going to complain. The way that we did it made very clear that we were doing it and it gave people a concrete choice of, you know, love it or leave it, double down or opt out. And almost, I think 95%ish, uh, like tilt to 95% of people stayed because this was the forecast they
1:58:01wanted. And then like less than 1% were um moderated out and chose not to appeal. And then some fraction about about one-thirdish of those who were moderated out and appealed had their you know accounts granted back. And then about 4% of people decided okay that they want to leave. And you know what that's great you know I'm I'm I'm glad I I hope that they do. You know there's tons of other clients tons of other not just on Farcaster but other protocols and so forth.
1:58:29Sure. Yeah, because the thing is that look, Dan and Rich had this weird thing where they were stuck in like Dan had this initial thing that he loved doing. He loved doing it, okay? Because he could hang out with his friends and everybody liked it and so on and so forth.
1:58:46And then what happened was those friends because many of them were economically successful. The 2024 thing attracted so it went from friends farmers airdrop farmers flood foes finished and maybe Phoenix let's hope okay and I agree with you that yes I totally get that and I agree with you that if there wasn't a drastic change it's likely going to zero
1:59:15oh it was we've been watching it we've been watching it we we track this we tal talk about it, we could see it.
1:59:22So, there had to be something really different done to keep it going.
1:59:26I I'd go even further and say, assume it was zero. Why? Because um first of all, the entire former team had left. Okay, they you know they they're amazing people. Again, they got most of them had gone to tempo and so on. First, the entire former team had left.
1:59:41Two, the second team left. They also didn't want again the term community isn't really captured. It was just a thankless job of a lot of people who yeah basically thought that the way that they got change was not by contributing capital, not by contributing labor, but simply by yelling complaints at Dan or Rich at high volume. And by the way, those complaints, if you do an AI analysis, are inconsistent and contradictory. You know, we want more building, we want more trading, we want
2:00:09more this, we want like everybody who has a complaint in their head is thinking about their own preference vector. Absolutely. and they're not seeing everybody else's. And moreover, they're just they just, you know, again, by the way, I blame social media for this. It's not just obviously Varcaster, as you said, Adrian, a lot of people are responding to incentives that are being set up. They're not necessarily bad people. I grant that, but somebody has to change those incentives. I'm going to come back to what the path forward is in a second. Okay. But the issue is that Dan and then Rich, I
2:00:38mean, you saw how happy Rich was. I love Rich. Rich was like ecstatic. We love it.
2:00:44Somebody else. It's, you know, somebody else could because it was just a thankless job, right?
2:00:51You know, there's somebody Okay. There's a there's a there's a woman who worked on on the team and um she said something like, "Oh, you know, she didn't want to post as like a like a core team member because she would get attacked for that." I'm like imagine like like the US government like a like a you know the to attack like a US postal service worker was like even more ser obviously you don't attack any citizen but why would you attack a postal service that's like a that's a
2:01:19more serious thing right there should be absolutely nobody if you want to just scream abuse at like the operators of a platform if you want to scream abuse at women if you want hate speech if you want all that stuff go somewhere else 4chan exists blue sky exists, right? Far right exists, far plenty other places.
2:01:37This is not that place. You will respect others here, right? Be nice or else or else find another client. And um so very very firm on that. And what that means is to be clear when you're firm once complete unyielding because what world are we creating, right? You know, look, you know, if you are immer to to give a very obvious example, if you go to China, you know the term immersion, like language immersion.
2:02:03Yep. Okay, if you go to China and you're immersed in China, okay, you learn Chinese, you start to speak Chinese. Now, do I think that X on balance is better for the world than what was there pre2022? I do. Okay. However, if you are immersed on X, you speak XXX.
2:02:26Okay. Like like that's very much an adult platform in the sense of people are fighting, they're screaming, they're like if your mind is already fully formed and you remember the offline world where normative behavior was the FCC broadcast standards we were talking about. Now unless you and I, you know, are I don't know. I don't I I've never asked a woman, you know, but but basically let's say we've remembered both both Adrian and I are Gen X. We'll just leave it at that. We're we're in
2:02:53that range. Yeah. Yeah. We'll be very public about that.
2:02:57Fine. So, we all remember the offline world, which was offline America in particular, which is a pretty good place really. 80s, 90s, early 2000s, really up until about 2012, America is a pretty good place, right? Then the the screaming and fighting really started ramping up. Okay. Point being that um while if you're immersed in China, you speak Chinese. If you're immersed in today's social media, especially those who don't have a memory of what offline
2:03:27norms were, right, they are learning some very bad things. What are they learning? First, you know, the way that the way to resolve a dispute is to get online, frame it in the most incendiary terms possible, rouse the largest mob, and try to humiliate the other guy into submission.
2:03:47And you get clicks and you build a following doing that, showing how tough you are. Right. Right. or or how much of a victim you are. Go ahead.
2:03:53Yeah. No, that's the the incentives.
2:03:55It's, you know, show me the incentive, I show you the outcome. It's it's the Charlie Mer of it all. Yeah.
2:04:00Right. And now, who benefits from that?
2:04:01Well, the social media platform gets 100,000 or a million views out of it.
2:04:06Okay. But enormous damage is done to the social fabric with every such fight because all the people are rooting it on and they're seeing that the Now, by the way, by contrast, in tech, what's the saying? Praise publicly, criticize privately. Okay? If you have a private channel, never use a public channel. I see like no one's taught these young people these obvious things, right? You know, the the uh I don't know the 1950s ways of saying it might have been like if you don't have something nice to say, don't say at all, but the somewhat more
2:04:35sophisticated way is like obviously feedback is useful. Corrective feedback is useful. But if you're somebody's friend and you genuinely wish them well or even if you just want to see the thing resolved, private feedback, praise privately, praise publicly, criticize privately, giving private feedback. Why?
2:04:51Often you don't have all the context, right?
2:04:54The other person is working on the problem. They have all the context. And in private, they might be able to have a give and take with you where they show you some things you and they're like, "Oh, I didn't realize that." And so on. Okay, that's different than I thought. Okay, I understand you're making decisions I would in the situation that you're in. Or conversely, they can even Well, yeah, you get something private.
2:05:13You're way more open to hearing what the person says and you don't need to defend publicly because okay, I'm t I can hear you. It's just information and it's feedback. But when I get criticized, if you're criticizing someone publicly, it's not I can't react. I now have to defend my reputation.
2:05:31That's exactly right.
2:05:32And I can attack back.
2:05:33That's right. And so posting, you know, like like going for clout, right, is like a barbarian way of resolving disputes, which is like the post Roman collapse to the dark ages. We're actually seeing the speedrun of that where because there's no central authority to appeal to, people just rouse the largest mob they can and just fight back and forth. Now, the thing is, again, unfortunately, because of social media, we've all had to do this in self-defense over the last x number of
2:06:01years, okay? But it's not how we want to live. There has to be a better way. And it's definitely not how we want to teach the next generation because they don't have that polite offline world anymore.
2:06:11They don't have the normative example of how things are supposed to be, right?
2:06:15Another version of this. Another goof and gallant. Do you remember goof and gallant?
2:06:19I did not. She did. And I had And then I was reminded I think I was more focused in highlights and like finding the things and the what's between these two. I was in the I was I was in the puzzles, you know.
2:06:32That's right. So like so like right. Goofus will uh goofas will um litter and gallant will go and put in the trash, right? Goofus for a modern example will play his, you know, music on speaker, right? And Gallant will wear headphones. Okay? And in general, all Goofus and Gallant can be boiled down to goofus does what is convenient to himself without concern for others and
2:07:00gallant takes some small hit to himself so that the commons isn't a tragedy.
2:07:05Right now, there's a certain pseudosmart way of talking about this where they'll quote Ben Franklin to me and they'll be like, "Oh, what are you saying?" But Ben Franklin said, "He who gives us some liberty to gain some security deserves neither." Now, here's the thing. First of all, Ben Franklin himself knew that wasn't the case because what is the military? If you join the military, join join the US Marine Corps, like uniform, military code of justice, you absolutely give up some liberty to gain some security, right? You're you're up at
2:07:33dawn. You you know the like there's things that are illegal in um in in the military code that aren't illegal in in in you know in civilian code. You give up plenty of liberty and the whole point is now you can be a fighting force and you actually have greater security.
2:07:48Ultimately this whole thing of he who gives up some liberty to gain some security deserves neither is a rejection of the idea of trade-offs, right? It's like he who deser gives up some money to get some food deserves neither. What are we talking about? You like you know you have you have trade-offs, right? There's trade-offs with everything, right? Now you might be pri you might be below the pritotalimal. You might be able to get a better trade-off. You might have to get more costefficient um you know food for your dollar. You might be able to give up less liberty to gain more security. I grant that you can improve the
2:08:17trade-off, but a trade-off does exist, right? And these people who think that they can be incredibly selfishly individualistic. It's actually not really a left versus right thing. It's like a anarchy versus civilization versus tyranny thing, right? For example, like you know, I understand how Andrew Tatism came about, but what I'll often tell people on the right is individually alpha is collectively beta.
2:08:42I actually post this on Farcaster, right? Individually alpha, right? If do you remember my post on this like a year ago or something?
2:08:47This sounds Yeah, this sounds really familiar. I feel like I remember saying that.
2:08:52Yeah, we must have talked about it. This is actually the masculine argument against or the man let's call it the center-rightish argument against the far right is you know just like for example the far-left on communism promised the workers that they'd have abundance and it actually delivered the goolog right so the center-left argument against the far left is even on the left's own terms of providing you know safety and welfare and so on and so forth the center left the more capitalist left is actually
2:09:21better than the far left at providing for the people, at providing wealth for the people. Like the far left actually can't do what it promises to do. It makes their life worse, right?
2:09:30Similarly, the the far right promises to provide power for the people just like the far left promises to provide money for the people. So far right promises to provide power for the people, but guess what? If everybody's just like flexing and the the cult of ultraviolence and so on and so forth, like, okay, maybe one Andrew Tate can beat up like one and this is not meant to be anti-Tate. I'm not even taking a position on that. episode. Let's say we can take a position on that.
2:09:55Let's just say one person leave him out of it or whatever. Let's say one person I understand how he arose by the way. So that's why I'm not I I don't I don't want to, you know, get into this completely, but let's say one alpha male, okay, big muscular person could go and beat up one Chinese factory worker. Probably true.
2:10:13Okay. But 10,000 Chinese factory workers will be able to cooperate and organize these 10,000 people who take some hit to themselves, give up some liberty, gain collective because they can turn out a factory and and drones and all this stuff and they can wipe the floor with 10,000 guys all flexing as individualists, right? So that's why the center is about scaled cooperation.
2:10:36That's why democratic capitalism was in the 20th century able to out compete both the far-left communism and the far right of fascism because they didn't build the scaled cooperation set. That scale cooper ultimately generates more wealth. So it it you know more money for the people and more power for the people. Okay. Yeah.
2:10:52And that's like an enlightened centrism.
2:10:54By the way, crucially this is not in my case in my view the naive centrism of let's try and bring back the American center within America. I think unfortunately that's done over. That's gotten split into far left and far right. I think the internet, the decentralized center is where things are going to have to go.
2:11:15Maybe I I still have hope. I have hope for the center.
2:11:20So, I I don't disagree where we are now that you're probably right, but that's a whole other conversation. I know I let me make one remark there which is to say uh of course I love the America that I grew up in that we all grew up in and so it's I also have but I just think that the mechanism for restoring anything like that is going to be coming up with a civilized community on the internet and then printing it out in the physical world within right within America and then outside. I think
2:11:48there's Yeah. When I think back to, you know, when I I've talked to other family members or or whatever about like when I was in college, we could have civil discussions gone out the window.
2:12:00We could disagree.
2:12:01Disagree and not each other.
2:12:03Exactly. Like very It was normal. It was very normal to have. Yeah.
2:12:09I have a I I do want to show you something which explains in my view why that broke down. Okay. Maybe you can put this article on screen. Okay. Um, I'll let Yeah, I'll let you grab it. And if you just want to add it to the one.
2:12:21Yeah. And then let's do lightning round because I about 15 more minutes. So, I know you probably we're probably getting up. So, what I want to do is try to summarize a few things that I know people have questions about. So, sure.
2:12:32Um, and I think you covered a lot of this really really well and thoroughly and I appreciate that. Um so in terms of where Farcastaster is going the the sort of your goal and your view is really about bringing these collective startup cities on board and growing that sort of thinking and finding maybe the other folks who are interested in those concepts ideas creating a more civil
2:13:00community and building that community. I also know that you have thoughts around um we haven't talked about Farcaster prizes and what you're thinking there.
2:13:09Yes. Like that kind of earn you mentioned earn and learn but we really didn't dive into that too much. So can you sort of speak to what does Farcaster look like a year from now? And also one other question before I forget the protocol itself. So you're now the steward of the protocol as well as the owner of you know the client the reference client. So, does that still remain open? Do people still can build other clients if they don't like the
2:13:37reference client? What how does that all work?
2:13:40Okay, so let me take those in reverse order. So, currently the draft idea draft draft draft subject to revision.
2:13:47Okay. draft is that um we will try to if we can um just given given scarce engineering resources that's uh release everything we can open source okay and then have like you know how like there's there's a um well I was I was I was gonna say WordPress.com and WordPress.org but obviously there's a whole conflict
2:14:16around that. Okay. Um, but let's say there's another version of software where there's a hosted version and there's an open source version. Okay.
2:14:24In a sense, all the critiques of of Dan and so on being, hey, it's implicitly hosted. And he'd say, you know, and like he's just like this this kind of like job, you know, figure from the Bible who's just enduring so many sticks and hours over the years. He'd say, "Okay, you know, go build your own." So, what I just want to do is have something that's MIT license or BSE license or whatever.
2:14:46We have to figure out the license. It's the full open source stack. Knock yourself out with claw opus 5.5. Knock yourself out. Community of communities over there. If you want to be part of our community of communities, it'll be a big tent, but not an infinite one. Okay. You basically have to be pro- civilization. By the way, I think that like if you look at the speakers at network conference, it's a very very very in like I hate to use the term diverse crew. We're way more diverse than quote democrats or something like
2:15:15that. We have people from 80 countries at network school, right? Like in the sense that we have, you know, we have people who are um put it like this in terms of ethnic, religious, racial, etc., etc. Diversity.
2:15:31Diversity of thought. That's right. So to be clear though, they're all pro- civilization, pro-respectful discourse, and so on and so forth. Okay. And that's really important. So it's it's in a sense as civilized as the right wants, as inclusive as the left claims to want.
2:15:48Okay? Or let's say as civilized as the right claims to want, but the right has a lot of face tattooed guys nowadays. As inclusive as the left claims to want, but the left will do a lot of purity testing nowadays. So we're taking at least what their claims are. Inclusion and civilization are both feasible in a Singapore or Dubai or El Salvador Kstan like environment where law is is there and it's actually enforced. Okay? And whenever you're ramping up, then there's always going to be somebody who complains about how it's ramped up, blah blah. Fine. Okay. And then basically then they have to look to substance as
2:16:16opposed to process, right? The substance is, do you want the substance of Singapore or not? That's really what it is. Okay. And if you don't, great. There's 4chan over there. There's a sewer right there. Be my guest. Go.
2:16:27Okay. And by the way, to be simply censorship resistant is not to say what you want to say. Like what do you want to say, right? Like censorship resistance, decentralization, that's what you're against. But what are you for? One has to have a positive vision of the future, right? Like to be central to resist like okay Solzenitson he put out the gulag archipelago. He was a critic of the Soviet Union. Great. Okay, he did, right? But he had a vision of what he was for. You may disagree with this vision, but he wanted like a restoration of like Russian traditional culture and so on and so forth. Okay,
2:16:56you have to have a vision of what you're for, not simply what you're against. You do need sometimes both, but you need this more than the other one. Okay. Um now what is what is uh Farcastaster in um like in a year TBD obviously it's going to be iterative and so on but very importantly we are going to do blue ocean things not red ocean okay you ever hear that saying red ocean is like red ocean is a competitive space where there's other clients and and you're benchmarking and like so for example do
2:17:26I care about DAUs I do not care about DAUs do I care why do I not care about that what I care about you saw the graph I with friends.
2:17:33That's important. And that's important because I think there's a lot of focus right now on like, well, you just got rid of you went from 37 users to 30 users or whatever.
2:17:41And I think that's an important note that a lot of people may not realize that that's not a important goal to you.
2:17:47Yeah. And let me explain why. Let me explain why. Um, my friend Sir Christian, um, who was actually an early caster user as well. You might know him. He's, you know, so, uh, he has a great post called build something no one else is measuring.
2:18:00Okay. Okay, I'm paraphrasing it. Which means like you know what uh what Facebook play a different game.
2:18:06You have to play a different game.
2:18:07That's right. Like what Uber did is it optimized earnings for drivers. It's not the same as DAUs.
2:18:13Um what uh you know like um like different different companies are optimizing different things. And in my view um we don't need another social network. We don't need another crypto trading app. We don't need another even censorship resistant thing because bit chat and all this stuff exists again like it's by the way it's not that frequent necessarily that you need to get a message in a bottle out and if you do like you know ship in a bottle message you know you can put that on on on the Bitcoin protocol you put that on the Salana protocol put that on Ethereum
2:18:41protocol it's actually okay for just posting like emergency messages you've got lots of options for that right what is scarce is crypto civilization okay so what does that look like first of all that means self-improvement okay So learn and earn every day online. Okay. So all the stuff I taught I taught a MOO that had 250,000 students.
2:19:04I deeply believe in free online education. But I also believe in the rigor of academia and so on. And you know so my father came from a very very very very poor background in in I mean when India was very poor okay like probably bottom quartile if not bottom 10% of like the world economy at that time right and and he made something of himself and he gave his son an opportunity and that's what I want to do for others so I'm plowing you know a good chunk of my capital into network school into the endowment here we're
2:19:33getting um this was actually all announced at network state conference we're getting full accreditation from the government of Kasan to be able to issue full degrees. Okay, love that.
2:19:42So, what is that? That's an intermediate between Harvard and Zuckerberg. Okay, Harvard is or it's an intermediate. It's also like Z-axis in a way. Harvard is the four-year traditional degree and so on. But that's actually with the great inflation, all the other problems of American academia. I don't need to go into all them right now from AI faking all the exams and you know, professors fighting each other, funding cuto offs, reproducibility crisis.
2:20:03We should have a whole other discussion on that because I'd love to. We have three we works at a university but we have three kids in university right now between the two of us. So we have a lot of it very familiar with problems in academia.
2:20:17So so on the one hand that's bad. On the other hand yes Zuckerberg Gates Vitalik are so talented these teal fellow type guys or you know what have you that they can create a universe unto their own like they they don't need any structure.
2:20:31They can actually do it better and they're few and far between. Yeah, they're few and far between. So most people do need some structure, right? So the the premise of network school is structured speedrun.
2:20:43Okay, so it's an inter interpolation.
2:20:45Again, between tyranny and anarchy, there's many intermediates. Is intermediate exactly 50%. I don't think it is. Is intermediate necessarily within the United States? I don't necessarily think it is. I think it's on the internet. But is it something that would appeal to someone who's a centrist American? I think it usually does. Okay. So the structured speedrun would be something where it's graduation by examination not duration.
2:21:07So rather than a four-year thing where you have to be there for four years or even K through 12, you can just skip grade, skip grade, skip grade by passing out zip zip zip like this.
2:21:17Prove you know it. Yeah. But prove it for real.
2:21:20Correct. Rigorous proctored examinations. That's right. So this is now how does it relate to Farcastaster?
2:21:25So if you can prove onchain that you have crypto credentials as demonstrated by an offline test. So we give we administer an offline test right example at a crypto conference. We give an Ethereum SAT. Okay. We give and then if you get it right pencil and paper proctored then we write that with your consent obviously to your Farcaster profile. We send you an NFT saying you got so such and such a score. Now you qualify for a whole new set of tasks.
2:21:55based on that score.
2:21:57So you learn to earn and you learn and you can cryptographically prove that you've learned because you get an NFT from a professor. This is something also that can increase professor monetization. Why? For example, I had a professor named Steven Boyd, okay, at Stanford. He's the doen of something called convex optimization. Convex optimization has created countless billions in value. Okay, he's captured some of that as an adviser to companies.
2:22:22But let's say that some fraction of his students had the Boyd Convex optimization NFT and some fraction of tasks that were earned by them could flow back to him like a referral thing. Okay. Now that's something where to level other people up in the world to cause human capital gain. You get a slice of that yourself.
2:22:40That's interesting.
2:22:41So that's now something where you know people talk about NFTs for attribution and like copyright, right? This is not like the downside of copyright, but it's like the upside of, okay, give the professor a slice and so on and so forth. And maybe that's a condition of him sending over the NFT and so and so. There's various ways we can implement this.
2:22:58So, I've used I've used PO I up until this semester, I've used PO apps in my class as they finish this the class to kind of designate in their wallets that they've finished my class. So, that's something I've been I've been using for a while that to kind of so they have proof on chain.
2:23:12That's that's great. So, so exactly like so like in India we call this guru dakina right meaning if somebody has taught you something thank the teacher you know like the American tradition is like put an apple on the teacher's desk and that's good but basically like you know the the guru will give you some money and then sometimes you'll also thank the guru with with something right I am not against this at all this sounds great great so right so I we want and and the thing is also we have I have enough you know as I said my previous life I was a
2:23:41professor right um And so we have um we have enough um background in academia, right? We have enough of of this kind of thing. Okay. In order to um like get the rigor of what traditional academia was, but then also what the internet is. Okay. Yeah.
2:24:06And so it's like like an interpolation, but not a naive interpolation. Sort of like how you know there's there's fiat and there's bitcoin and coinbase is an interpolation but not bank chain. Bank chain was a naive interpolation that didn't work. It took the worst of both worlds. You want to take the best of both worlds. So the exact interpolation matters. Okay.
2:24:21So the putting this into caster what it means is you take practice tests in caster like tutorials come up in your feed whatever you know people declare what their interests are right. Yeah.
2:24:31So the interest you get something looks a lot like a survey. It's like a question and you get it right or wrong. And computer adaptive testing gives you the next question and you get it right or wrong and you're learning something. You're actually progressing up the skill ladder that you wanted. And then when you get enough of them right, then we say, "Okay, now you've done the practice. Take a proctor test offline."
2:24:51And now if you pass that, you qualify for all these new set of tasks, right?
2:24:58such that you can get a you know whatever $100 task as an Ethereum developer because people because right now one of the things to give another piece of this as a hiring manager I have like on a thousand portfolio companies okay and and people are feeling oh my god I can't get a job why lots of candidates are spamming inboxes okay right and then conversely there people are using AI to filter inboxes and like the AI has just increased the noise in the channel the matching channel many things are like this right it's similar
2:25:26to the problem with Tinder the internet um the internet improves certain kinds of matching like Uber like passenger driver and it actually breaks other things that were working before and we have to be we have to understand that it's broken some markets as much as it build them okay point is as as a company as a hiring manager you can't tell what's fake or what's real anymore right like even LinkedIn actually is asking people to use AI to make their resumes so everybody declares themselves expert in this that and the other and now they
2:25:55also have the jargon on their profile So the it can really blend in, right?
2:26:01You can tell if it's AI and pang, but like the thing is nobody's doing that, right? So we will basically have what I call the crypto resume, right? which is a combination of whatever selected casts or you know that you want on there, whatever post you want on there, your self assertion, but it also has all of your crypto credentials that you've earned with practice tests, every vouch that you've gotten from others, okay?
2:26:28Um, every procured exam that you choose to show there, okay? And so, think of it as crypto LinkedIn, which and LinkedIn does have discussion by the way. The problem is like you know LinkedIn it's actually a hundred billion dollar company even as much as I I you know look with the founders gone I can just say you know no one's going to be offended LinkedIn does kind of suck right but why does it kind of suck because it's fake nice okay Twitter is fake nasty X is fake nasty right so in LinkedIn
2:26:57people are like you know Soviet style like thank you comrade for the this that and the other the green okay and and also there's lots of fake resumes literally fake in many ways Okay. But at least the fact that they've got their full professional thing on their bio means they don't let go and scream slurs at other people too much.
2:27:13Exactly. They don't want it to come back at them, right?
2:27:16They don't want to come back at them. There's actually a downside for doing it. It has a degree of civility in it's probably the best behaved forum on the internet. Okay.
2:27:23On the other hand, on X, people have learned that incorrectly people perceive negativity as more authentic, right?
2:27:30So they're a fake nasty version of themselves on X. X is now also player versus player. Look, as I said, do I prefer X to Twitter? Yes, because on Twitter it was totally one-sided barbarism. Now, at least it's both sides, all sides. You can fight back. But do we want to fight all day? No. And you may disagree with this. I totally understand that. Right.
2:27:47No, I just don't want to fight all day. I agree with that. But I don't fight.
2:27:49That's right. Yeah.
2:27:50What I want to do is learn and earn. And I mean, I don't even care about earning so much myself, but I want to provide that ability for others to grow. But it's growth, right? Like personal growth, right? If you don't want to earn, at least you're growing and you're learning something. Even if that's even if you don't take that next step, it can be interesting.
2:28:07That's exactly right, Adrian. I think actually that's what you know, we've had like sort of a I'll give you an NFT for that ideaology. You can an attribution back.
2:28:16Well, I I think you know that's Sure.
2:28:18Great. Sure. Basically, um self-improvement, personal growth, right? With a locust of control being within yourself where you're not envying others. You're just the best the right kind of ambition is to be the best version of yourself. Okay? and like like to max out your own your own qualities because you know like every human has some spark in them right and your own zone of genius right go ahead sorry but I think that's also how a little bit how far caster I was in the beginning
2:28:48because I felt like I was learning something new all the time there were amas that were really interesting all that kind of stuff that I love here's yeah yes but there's one big difference which is and I think this is an innovation that we have that um I think Dan would probably agree with me on this. The early forecaster was um a lot of founder and VC types, right?
2:29:11Who are very successful professionally, very self-directed, but their earn and learn was happening mostly offplatform, right?
2:29:19Okay. Now the thing is as much as I like the Silicon Valley YC tealish culture it does have one issue which is ironically it doesn't scale beyond a quote elite right as as uh as Tim Ferrris said you know like okay you're you have to be like a digital Jason Bourne to survive okay and it's frankly like I see the rate of digital change and it's hard for you know sometimes I'll send Vitalic
2:29:47something and I'll say like are you smart enough to understand this? And he'll be like, "No, I'm not." And I'm like, "I'm not," you know, and so like basically it's just something where some of this stuff, I mean, it's kind of joking or whatever, but the point is it's like uh the pace of change, certain kinds of things, it's so fast that uh you can obviously put something into an AI, it can explain it to you. This is meant to be a joke, but the point is even for somebody who's like a PhD or whatever, it's hard. So, how do we scale
2:30:16that culture? Like where's the simul of middle class culture? You know, somebody said something like I'm single until series B in San Francisco, right?
2:30:27Okay. What does that mean? That means that they have taken what used to be the American dream, which is, you know, like graduate from school, get a job, find somebody, raise a family, have a house, get kids, right?
2:30:41That whole thing is now something where you have to be digital Jason born in order to achieve that, right?
2:30:46Okay. So single distrib. It's not even that these people are passionate about building companies. It's that they want to have a spouse. So they they feel they have to win in a startup in order to afford a house.
2:30:56Right. They have to put that off until a certain point. Yeah. Exactly.
2:30:59That's that's bad for many reasons because first is pushing people into quote startups that shouldn't necessarily be there. But second is the 99% of the population that can't do that. Oh my god, they're mad, right? And so it's it's a setup for a lot of bad things. What you want instead is a zone where civility is free. And you want to also be able to scale a lot of the positive things of Silicon Valley to those who are not necessarily founder people. Okay. Why do I say that? I one of the things I say a lot today is
2:31:28there's fewer founders like unicorn founders I should say than there are professional athletes. Okay. To be a unicorn founder you know like can you dunk from the free throw line technically? If not don't be a startup founder.
2:31:43Okay. Like basically if you're have you ever seen somebody just to digress this have you ever seen somebody who's like a pro alete in high school like really athletic?
2:31:53Yeah. Occasionally it's it happens and you see the ones who go right from high school now.
2:31:57Yeah. Like I you know like I was in I was in great I played Go ahead.
2:32:02I saw Kobe in high school. I saw Kobe play in high school up in Philadelphia in the late 90s. You did high school. My guess, Adrian, is uh you know, I I saw when I was playing varsity football, I was not great. I was terrible. Okay. But, you know, I one time we did play um another team and there was a guy who was so ridiculously athletic that he could just be walking on their team and you could be like it was it was just something
2:32:31where, you know, there's like a like a like a lope to it where you know it when you see it.
2:32:37Hard to describe words, huh? Go ahead.
2:32:38Yeah. You know it when you see it.
2:32:40Yeah. And that guy Exactly. That's right. You know, so that guy became like a wide receiver in in the pros. Okay. Like you could just tell this guy was just like insanely like man among boys level athleticism.
2:32:52The worst professional athlete is like a hundred times better than any athlete you've seen growing up. Like if you it's like it's they have an effortless grace to them, you know? They could just go like this, you know? Right. They're just their their entire body neuromuscular system is all wired just differently than a normal human being. Okay. That's what a unicorn founder is typically like.
2:33:14Okay. And the thing is people can't perceive that in the same way because they don't like Okay, take let's take Vitalik again, right? Vitalic is relatively, you know, he's he's he's what he is in the physical world. He's a tall guy and so it's relatively skinny. in the digital world, he's like a 500 foot tall like fire giant with like a flaming sword and so on and so forth.
2:33:35Like if you saw the World of Warcraft digital Vitalic, it's like this gigantic kind of thing, right?
2:33:41So in the same way because people cannot perceive mathematical technical ability necessarily immediately. They can't necessarily see how good these unicorn founders typically are, right? And it's not always just math or or computer science that that helps. It can be just work ethic, endurance, resilience. A lot of these guys are very very very very amazing. I, you know, I've known a bunch of them and the point being most people aren't like them, right?
2:34:06And they shouldn't they shouldn't be forced to be like them. One thing I realized in San Francisco is there's an epidemic. Now, to be clear, I like these people much more than wokes, but there's an epidemic of um like like people who had founder itis, right? Like kind of entrepreneurs, okay?
2:34:22And the same way that someone would buy Michael Jordan sneakers to kind of pretend to be Michael Jordan. It took me a long time to understand that's what they were doing. They were buying like allirds and they were mimicking some of the sort of consumerrist ways, the things where you could hit a button and purchase it to be like Jack Dorsey or something like that, right? But that consumerrist thing is just the most superficial aspect of it. What it's again, it's like buying Michael Jordan sneakers or a jersey to be Michael Jordan. You you have to actually the greatest strength is no one's own weakness and what you're actually good
2:34:52at. Right. Okay. So now let's get to or biology or like posting because Elon does that.
2:34:57Right. Like that's what makes Elon great. Like and then that exactly. Exactly. Don't people copy his style and they think they can be like say stupid to people and it's like I'm like Elon.
2:35:13Here's the thing. Elon Elon is N of one. Elon is so exceptional on so many dimensions. You should not try to be like Elon because like okay for several things. First is just on this got me on this topic for a second.
2:35:29Elon is somebody who Jensen Wong and Larry Page and every you know like I know a lot of whatever I know a lot of these guys right who are very senior kind of people especially the guys at the hundred billion dollar companies versus the trillion dollar companies. I know a lot of them personally. Um, and a lot of these guys, every one of us, Elon is just so much better than the best.
2:35:48He's like, you know, have you seen that graph with Messi and how Messi is like five or six divisions out and even other great soccer players are like three. Okay, so Elon is like that relative to other like his his like number 10 accomplishment like Neurolink or or Boring Company is better than many amazing people's allin full life force.
2:36:09And yet he's doing that while he's doing like six of them and he's got like the most crazy personal life which I couldn't imagine. Um, you know, don't don't do this at home, kids. Do not do this at home. Okay.
2:36:21You can't have one spouse and raise children in a loving family and have a very boring.
2:36:29This is by the way I I I've never really talked about this but one of you know one of the most interesting things for me about network school like the very first iteration okay is there was a fair number of people who came in and on paper they agreed with me see I knew that there were people who would type out that they were far-left who wouldn't agree with me but there were people who were like extremely libertarianish on paper who agreed with all the stuff that I was saying online sovereign individual whatever type stuff and then
2:36:58when I met some of them person, I realized that there was an aspect of myself that I had taken for granted that I never broadcast, which is the traditional Asian family values, right? Like respect for elders, you know, self-discipline and all that kind of, you know, to me obvious stuff, right? And I realized that many of these people had come from broken homes or they had never learned they had no
2:37:25impulse control. And so they didn't like it's the American Asian, you know, synthesis that makes Silicon Valley.
2:37:33It's not 100% American. It is at least 50% Asian. I mean, obviously like Apple is is built in China and and and manufactured in California. Obviously, there's lots of Asian, Indian, what have you influence there. That is a that's an aspect of the world I don't think people have really caught into because the only recently now have some more of the frontmen being of Asian or Indian or what have you descent but there's something to the Asian Indian what have
2:37:59you Eur Asian thing of studying hard like respecting your elders getting the numbers right you know like children within marriage all these square conservative traditional values and then you have that combined with the freewheeling American kind of thing, but only that on top of this. Okay? Like the American freewheeling kind of thing works when you have a core and a boring,
2:38:28you know, home life, a degree of self-discipline, like you know, middle class values, first class results. Okay?
2:38:35Like, you know, if you if you've got your feet on the ground, then you can reach for the stars. And this is, by the way, like what America used to be. This is, you know, the Iowa guys who, you know, built uh uh Fairchild and so and so forth like um you know, Robert Noise and so like middle class values first class results and you know this type of stuff. One of the one of the things that gets difficult about this is immediately people will be like that they'll have some family issue or they'll have some you know kind of thing that they that
2:39:03they don't really like but they also don't want you calling it out. I'm not calling anybody out on this. I'm just saying what we want to be able to do is figure out how to say a that is bad. B I'm not attacking anybody who is a victim of those circumstances or what have you. C let's figure out how to build a society where we can rebuild those positive pro-ivilization values. D Asia has a lot going for it because it has a lot of those things already in exance, right? And in many ways like the move from smalltown America to
2:39:32Singapore, Farcaster is now half Asian. Okay. It's got a lot more Asian influence than it did like all American.
2:39:40Unfortunately, this century doesn't work. As much as I love America, it's going to be half. Okay. It's going to be like that's what tech is. It's half American, half Asian. And the discipline, the law, the self-discipline even more important than external discipline. That's the thing is it's much more about self-discipline. It's internal control than it is about external regulation. All of that is like a cultural kind of thing where every all the words are on top of like like patterns of behavior. Okay, coming back.
2:40:08So, um why' I get on that? Uh you said something.
2:40:12We've we've lost I don't I don't remember where how we got here, but something about I know you're I know you're you're we're running out of time.
2:40:19Yeah, I know. Yes. So, let's like try to sum up um just sort of where your where the instead of a year, where's the next month?
2:40:29Where are we going? What's going on?
2:40:31What is your focus? And what can we expect? Maybe that's a good way to sort of wrap this and how can people help?
2:40:38Like for people who are on forecaster, good.
2:40:41Like are there things?
2:40:43Um sure. Good question. So, first we're going to roll out some new features shortly. Okay. Um so, we've got some overdue features. So nice, nice, nice new things.
2:40:52Um, number two is um basically uh earn and learn. We want to um we want to make it a community where you can do tutorials and those tutorials qualify you for better tasks which in turn let you learn more and you get on a positive treadmill where you're improving your life. And where does the crypto aspect come in? By the way, it's not trading, right? It's also not quote
2:41:21building. Why is it not trading? It's not like, hey, let me have an NFT which I hope to pass on to a greater fool who hopes to pass on like that. I don't like that stuff at all. Right? That's not that's not the new Farcaster at all.
2:41:32Okay. Um, also building, look, do I like building? Okay. But the problem is AI has also made building really easy. You can build in a very narcissistic way that's only interesting to yourself. You can build AI slop trivially nowadays, right?
2:41:46Sure. Earning is the way that you see whether what you're done doing is of value to somebody else. Right? It's a thesis on providing value to the world. Right? Done right. It's service. It's not simply it's it's ikiguai. You know what I mean? It's like yes, you like it and you're good at it and you can get paid for, but it's also a value to the world. It's like all four of those things. The Japanese concept.
2:42:08Okay. So we want to do the vision is uh make it into the app that you log into to learn whatever technical or other especially technical skills especially cyber security and crypto and AI type stuff. So whatever technical skills you want to get up on and then use that to improve yourself professionally like a crypto LinkedIn kind of thing. Now, by the way, what comes out of that? Oh, also hold meetups, pop-ups, and permanence. Okay, so farcon and so by
2:42:37establishing that zone of people who are self-improving all the time. What that does, by the way, is it rather than them yelling at Dan or Rich or something like, you know, most of the day like in my head I'm yelling at myself. I'm like, h I should do this better. I should do that better. Yelling is way too strong a term. The point is like the the focus is the locus of improvement is within the self, right? So we're giving you things where if you lift that weight as achievable as it is, you get a little bit better every day. Okay,
2:43:05this is this also by the means the interface will change over time to emphasize your progress against your own benchmarks. Like for example, space repetition, we want to build that into the app, right? Computer adaptive testing, build that into the app. You're learning new skills. you were here on Chinese and now you're here, right? So you can see, you know, like Spotify wrapped like it gives you like your record. I'd love to have something where a year from now people have learned some new skill.
2:43:31Love that because we we sort of gamified learning. We gified earning and the reason I know this is likely to work.
2:43:39My MOO was quite popular and quite a few people told me they got like for example Alexander Lishman who's the CEO of River which is a successful Bitcoin company. He just posted that he got into Bitcoin. He got into crypto because of my class.
2:43:50Quite a few people have posted something like that. Okay, that's just one public example without revealing anybody's private se. It was actually a very popular product that we sold to Coinbase. I think it was ahead of its time and so on and so forth. It actually um Coinbase is 2021 financial. So it made like $63 million. Okay. So earn and learn is wholesome. Oh, one other thing very important. There's an genuine injection of value. Where's the injection of value? We're creating tasks and you're injecting your time. So it's digital labor for digital currency and
2:44:19the NFTTS and the crypto credentials structured that so you can prove your skills and the competition is a positive sum competition where it's not zero sum. For example, if I've got a classroom of 30 kids, 30 adults for that matter, they could all be at 0% on Chinese or they could all be at HSK9 on Chinese in theory.
2:44:40Right. It's you're improving against yourself. It's not positional versus somebody else. Right? They could all they could have like 0% Chinese install in their head or they could be fluent. Okay? And by doing that it's what I call human capital gain. Okay? You know the term human capital which is like in education. Okay. And capital gain which is buy low sell high.
2:45:02So human capital gain is you come on the app, you do tasks, there's tasks that are grayed out because you don't have the skill. You try the online practice things. Then you do the proctor one. Now you qualify for a whole new class of task. Also, we can have a coin market cap type thing with prices on skills.
2:45:20Guess what's soared, you know, all the AI tools, right? It's super valuable to know. So, now when you see that price has soared because the task price has soared now the market actually allocates because what happens is as you know with education, a poor art history major graduates and they realize the market value of their skill is very low. Right?
2:45:38If instead you improve that feedback cycle, how do you do that? I'll just say one more two more things then we go.
2:45:43Rather than the 48 months upfront of traditional college education, what if you spread those 48 months over 48 years? You had one month a year or 48 years. Okay, why is that better? Because like imagine you bought a car and you paid up front for it and you budgeted nothing for gas or maintenance over the course of the life.
2:46:01This is like people two or three years out of school. They say I don't remember what I learned.
2:46:06Right? Imagine if and the skills change. I mean the skills change too like what I went to school for 20 years ago everything I practiced in my software engineering life like I you couldn't have taught it to me.
2:46:16That's exactly right. That's right. And so this is now the thing is physicians do have something for this. They call it CME continuing medical education. Okay.
2:46:23So do lawyers. Yeah.
2:46:24So oh they okay great. So because obviously the surgery techniques of 1970 something are not going to be the same as today. So they keep taking modules and those modules qualify them for new credentials and they can do new surgeries and and so on and so forth.
2:46:37Okay. That is a good model for kind of what we want to do, right? So rather than 48 months up front, you have 48 months over 48 years. And actually, if you think about that, one month a year is like one week a quarter. One week a quarter is roughly a little bit less than one day a week. So imagine if that's a vision of network schoolcaster is lifelong learning where you're you know okay you're rather than just
2:47:05bouncing you know like this randomly to this topic and the other you're compounding right you're you're improving where whatever you set out to do learn you know learning wise obviously we'll start on technical topics we want to nail something right and you're not just learning for the sake of learning we're connecting that to crypto microtask and where does crypto come in why is it important
2:47:26Basically, if it's important to you, it's offline. If it's important to others, it's online. And if it's really important to others, it's onchain.
2:47:36Meaning, if it's something of economic value, you need to shield it on chain.
2:47:41Yeah. Exactly. So, you know, the the last 15 years of crypto, and I've got a longer talk on this, last thing I'll just say, last 15 years of crypto have arguably been starting with a replacement for US dollars. Okay. Right. And so there were three major things of that. There was programm Bitcoin. Then programmability got you Ethereum and Salana.
2:48:00Privacy got you like Monero Zcash and stability got you USDC and USDT. Okay. And the improvement on the US dollar on that piece of paper. The US dollar is like a trillion dollar industry. But I think the next step is to improve not simply on the piece of paper which is the US dollar but the other set of pieces of paper which are US documents.
2:48:20What's in a US document? Example, a diploma, right? Example, like a passport, right? Example, like a like a regulatory license. These pieces of paper are actually worth quite a lot of money. Diplomas, people will pay tens of thousands of dollars. And why are they US documents? Because it's not so much the US government necessarily directly issues you a degree, but what they do is they accredit a school to issue a degree, right?
2:48:42They also directly issue a password, they directly issue you a regulatory license. These pieces of paper facilitate the flow of these dollars, right?
2:48:53Yet crypto has not thought about them, not as much. Okay, so this was like the oneoff cash type transactions and so on.
2:49:02But these are all the piece of paper that you can imagine being and you can by the way you can break them down into individuals, companies or let's say individuals, organizations and metadata on those organizations. So you have like a proof of human for a person and then they have a diploma or even better a granular crypto resume which says you don't just have a degree in let's say computer science but you have operating systems compilers you know you know networking you know because some of these categories are very broad okay so you
2:49:32have an individual you have a diploma and then you have you know crypto credentials granular okay or you have a company individual can uh can also have own a company or an organization or be associated with one and That organization has attributes associated as well like okay here's this regulatory license right over time this is how we build a true crypto economy where the equivalent of US documents are put on chain they are attested to it's like a
2:50:00new kind of oracle service okay and we start with just like you know whether you got this question right or wrong over time we work with governments like governmenta like others there's actually 10 plus governments that want to host network schools okay amazing we have things that are like ETSs testing centers and we basically help you build your crypto resume and we help you improve in life. Okay, I have look I one the last thing I'll just say is in general I'm a minimum necessary conflict person. Okay, I mentioned this the other
2:50:29day but I I I you know the the thing is minimum necessary conflict does not mean shying away from every conflict but it does mean the minimum necessary conflict. Okay. And that means that uh we want to like I'll be completely firm in something that I think you know like if as I said if you want 4chan if you want blue sky go somewhere else those already exist. Okay we're going to have Singapore here you're going to you're
2:50:56not going to be able to yell at women you're not going to be able to yell like you know at at at at ethnic groups and so on and so forth like some of these people were doing but you're also not going to be able to yell at whites at men at capitalists. That's a class hatred by the way. Much of the 20th century was based on class hatred. So class hatred, race hatred, not allowed.
2:51:14And I don't care. You know, some people will say things like, "Oh yeah, normally wishing death on someone is bad, but they're a venture capitalist, so it's justified." Right? What is that actually saying, by the way, just to analyze that, that person is saying that it's like a it's like um the equivalent would be somebody saying normally killing someone who's bad, but they're Japanese, so it's okay. The only time that's ever ever happening is in wartime against
2:51:42Japan. Okay. Are you in wartime? Are we all in wartime against vic capitalists?
2:51:47Well, I wasn't told that because I am one. Right. So, this person who's saying, "Oh, wishing death on someone else is normally bad." I would agree.
2:51:55But this tribe is an enemy tribe, so it's okay to wish death on them. Is assuming that you share their literal blood lust, death wish, wartime mode against that enemy tribe. The thing is that everybody's a member of at least one of these tribes. Like everybody's either white or non-white or they're, you know, a citizen or an immigrant or they're male or or female. Like everybody is a member of at least one of these hated on classes. Like you get on X and you ask give me a million view thread about whatever your identity is.
2:52:22You'll find someone hating on you. So I don't really care what the justification is unless we're actually at war with those people. And we're not right. We just can't bring that here. Now, somebody might say one other thing I'll say like X is meant for war. Okay, the problem with X is you can't it's a public war zone. It's like if you don't have a presence on X, if you don't have um the ability to defend yourself on X,
2:52:50you will just get attacked. Okay, so you have to maintain a presence on X. But it's going to serve a completely different purpose from Farcaster. We're not competing with X at all. It's a totally different thing. it. This is a This is like a library.
2:53:03I think that's an important note. Like that's an important note like this is no longer trying to compete with other social networks. This is its own new thing and I think that's really important for everyone to understand because I think that's where some misconceptions have been.
2:53:19Absolutely. And the thing is I personally but I personally just like really love this vision because one of the reasons I loved X and it was actually Twitter or Twitter for so long was like I called it a university like it was yes I learned so much and I could you know you meet people from all over the world who share similar niche interests so you can kind of learn from people.
2:53:41Um and then I'm still very like dependent on X for news but I don't necessarily use it in the same way. So in in this split like that's what I really like the and I've had that experience on Parkcaster as well. Like I've learned a ton from various people over these years. Um you know so there that was still part of that core. There was definitely some learning there that was important and interesting and just interesting people.
2:54:08And when you find those interesting people who have expertise in certain areas that share them, you learn. And that to me is what made this an interesting place. So, I'd love to get back to that.
2:54:18Absolutely. And we're going to split that out completely. I mean, it's not that you can't learn on X, but it is something it's not set up for you to earn and learn and earn and learn and so on. It's just going to be a totally different focus. And um I feel pretty confident that um and third other third thing is la last thing I'll say is once we have this online civil community right which is earning and learning and earning and learning then we want to
2:54:45have a bunch of farcon type meetups pop-ups because basically if you can build mutual trust online like not a single person who's yelling and cursing like I don't some people will say oh I'm mean online but I'm nice offline. No, no, no. You're going to be nice online, too. Otherwise, you're not going to be at these meetups.
2:55:02I've met those people.
2:55:04And they are. They're really nice in person. They would never say that to you in person that they would say online and you're like, "Why do you do that?"
2:55:11Exactly. And the answer is the incentives. This is what Adrian does.
2:55:14And it influences people though. Like when people are shitty online, other people see it and then they mimic that behavior.
2:55:22That's right. Does that But guess what? You know what's much much more valuable than both the Soviet Union and Somalia? Singapore, right? Both tyranny and anarchy are not valuable and neither is an archetony.
2:55:35But what is valuable is Singapore. So and and what made Singapore valuable? If you read Lie Kuwanu's book from third world to first, the first thing he did was civility. You can't spit on the floor anymore. Sorry. Right? You just can't do all these univilized things. Okay? And you know he cracked down on gambling and everybody's like, "Oh my god." Right? He cracked down on OPM. He cracked down on all this kind of stuff.
2:55:57And guess what? Everybody liked it afterwards because now he could bring in large businesses. He could invest in public works. And he did things that were some of them seemed like, you know, basically, by the way, people to my right will be like, "Oh my god, Banji, you're such a statist. You're such a communist. I can't believe that you like, oh, it's code of conduct now.
2:56:18How'd you become so woke on me?" Blah blah blah. Right? And there's actually a fair number of people who say that kind of stuff to me as well, right? And um you're just a globalist, blah blah whatever, right? Okay, imagine that.
2:56:30Actually, that's like a less nasal voice. You're just a globalist like Alex Jones. Okay, fine. All right. Um so, so I don't actually care. What I care about is the result, right? You know, blue cat, red cat, doesn't matter if it catches mice, right? Doesn't matter if it's technoptimist. All right. with that.
2:56:46And the other thing I just wanted to mention when you're one of the other things that has been special about Farcaster has been that URL to IRL.
2:56:53So I like the idea of leaning into that. We did have Farcaster Fridays for a while that Ted was really focused on helping to organize where we had meetups every once a month, every Friday all over the world.
2:57:05If they're not nice online and they were Yeah. Go ahead. Sorry. Yeah. Go ahead.
2:57:08No, that was great. And that was great. So I'd love to see more of that.
2:57:11Absolutely. And so what what I love to so actually you asked how how people can help Adrienne I'd love to have people who we'll probably put out like a a thing on this but if you want to host a meetup like a farcon kind of meetup um the ideal person I didn't mention this is very important NSMB right network school small business one of the things about network school is because we have like hundreds of people from all around the world we're often the very largest customer of a small business like for example for a
2:57:39gym we'll get like a hundred memberships right for a coffee shop like it's just a surge of business for them once once we move into a region right and like a laundromat or something like that because we do it's like go ahead no so one way of thinking about it NS is like crypto Costco you have you know Costco you've got a membership card and then it brings down the cost of everything you're buying at Costco like you know you can you you pay a certain amount flat fee for the membership and then you
2:58:09get lowcost water and not you know I mean like pretzels whatever else everything else Kirkland brand or something else it's super inexpensive Costco you buy in bulk right it's a great deal for all parties because the subscription is not that expensive for Costco once it's got the subscription it can sell the rest at basically cost and for the guys who are selling to Costco they prefer to sell in bulk and to a reliable buyer and so forth right so it's a triple win where all parties you know can can cooperate to get a better better outcome for all parties so
2:58:38similarly with never We have like crypto Costco in the physical world in every school subscription because we can group a hundred or hundreds of people together.
2:58:48We get bulk discounts on gym memberships on all the costs in the physical world, housing, all this kind of stuff, right?
2:58:54So we hyperdelate and bring down the cost of living. We've got it down to less than $1,000 a month um in Aana right behind right for food for for room, food, gym, cell phone. you literally and co-working and events. You don't need anything else. Basically, sub10,000 a year. You have what I would consider like a life that is as good as what I had at Stanford in the early 2000s. Like basically, you know, you've got you got a totally functional environment where you can go and work.
2:59:19Okay. What's my point? Point is, um, with Farcaster, I'd like to source small businesses around the world that want business. Okay. They could be a restaurant. They could be a bar maybe depending on what they're what they're you know we want we want it to be like a not not super you know r rowous or what have you but like a night you know so restaurant maybe like a wine bar or something like that private rooms things like that. Yeah.
2:59:43Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. That's right. So, so restaurant, gym, somebody who can host a meetup, a hotel, right? Something like that.
2:59:52And they should be there because they own a small business. Lots of small businesses are hurting. You know, people are doing things online. They're not coming in person anymore.
3:00:01Now, they become they have a win-win.
3:00:04They are like a local Farcon NS, you know, person. They've got a small business. By the way, this is also a win for the meetup organizer. Why? If the meetup organizer is already a small business owner, they don't need to find and lease a location, which can often be a tricky thing to find a venue is often a tricky thing.
3:00:21If the person already owns a venue, they pay the fixed cost of having the venue and they just want the marginal revenue of people coming in. So that's a win-win for all parties concerned. The local small business gets 20, 30, 50 new people. The 20 30 50 new people don't have to spend any money or rather they just spend on refreshments or food. Uh and they don't need to keep renting a new venue each time. Right? So, if you asked, that's something we're going to put out. We're going to put a task uh on that for basically local local venues.
3:00:50We used to do like, like I said, the Farcaster Fridays were very popular for a while there. It was a lot of fun and a lot of people getting together. Yeah.
3:00:59All right. It's been amazing. That's been a lot.
3:01:02Yes. Come visit Estana, by the way. It's a beautiful, beautiful country. You do you see the post I put up with uh Jensen Hong?
3:01:08Yes. We showed it. Yeah, we showed it in the beginning of the show. Yeah. Before you came on and we were talking about that and showing off the the location and all the folks there. Yeah. Amazing.
3:01:20Incredible. Incredible. And Adrian definitely wants to come ride horses.
3:01:24Oh, you're you're all invited.
3:01:26Basically, anybody who's nice, just look, being nice is free, right? If you're just a nice person, civil person, come and hang out.
3:01:33I mean, it it sounds amazing. Sounds amazing. Well, thank you so much for joining us today. We really appreciate you taking the time. It's been a lot of time. We really appreciate it because this gave a lot of clarity to some questions that we had. For sure.
3:01:46Thank you so much.
3:01:47A request for a weekly uh a weekly call like this.
3:01:51Sure. Yeah. And actually, you know, look, I'm happy to collect um see I hesitate to call it community feedback. It'll eventually become a community again. Let's call it userbased feedback. And then as it knits, it'll become a community again. But but get the get the questions and and I'll definitely come back on. Okay.
3:02:06Love that. Love it. Thank you.
3:02:07Thank you so much for the time.
3:02:09We appreciate you.
3:02:12Amazing. That was incredible.
3:02:17You got him. I was doing the same thing.
3:02:19I took so many notes for our post show chat.
3:02:23God. Okay. Because I was I mean I don't know.
3:02:26We're gonna need We're going to need Warpie to help in a lot of this.
3:02:30Um, okay. I have a new drinking game for us to play.
3:02:33What's it called? Every time he says this is the last thing I'm gonna say.
3:02:38He started 55 minutes ago. I think 50 minutes ago. He's like, "Okay, I gotta wrap up." And he just kept saying He said, "I have 15 minutes."
3:02:46He just He's like, "Okay, this will be the last thing I say." And he and he and he kept talking. So, and guys, this is the only show we have this week. So, there you go. We gave you a we gave you a big one. Um, we're gonna have a lot of show notes. I don't think we missed too many things that we were going to talk about anyway. We got through most of it in the beginning of the show, so that was good. Um, and we didn't promote this specifically because we weren't positive he was going to make it today. It was maybe going to be next week. So, that's why you got surprise
3:03:14guest. Um, but wow, that was a lot. So I love the I mean so just to sum up for those who maybe just came in what have you. Um setting up the new code really first of all there was an existing code wasn't really being enforced or it was being enforced limited. So this is like a new new take at that code of conduct. One thing he said, new code of conduct, making it a vote or
3:03:41something you had to very specifically sign to make sure that you were fully aware rather than just a checkbox and I agree, which is what most terms of service do and then it doesn't get enforced unless there's a massive problem.
3:03:56Um, creating a world that's more civil and wanting to bring that back from the, you know, old existing world onto online. Um, and this is a whole new, and this is what I I was really trying to get him to like clarify, and I think he did there at the end, is that we got to stop thinking about it like it's the old Fire Cer because it's not. This is a whole new thing. It's not what we've been familiar with. And I think we have
3:04:24to start thinking about it that way because if we keep thinking about like, well, it's not what I used to like and I want the old thing back. It's not it's just not going to be that ever again.
3:04:35This is something completely new where it's going to be focused on learning. You mentioned learn and earn a few times where there's going to be whole new things that are rolled out that are very different from what we're used to. Um, what else did you take that I might have forgotten there? That was a lot.
3:04:54Um, those are the highlights.
3:04:56Well, I don't Yeah, I mean, we're not gonna summarize three hours, but um, you did a great job. Uh, no, my notes were more just things that I was like, oh, I want to that I just personally found interesting. One of the first thing he said that I thought was really interesting was he said like totalitarianism's bad.
3:05:16And then he said like the worst, you talking about polit like in the political systems and he's like wor a little bit better than that is anarchy, right? So like no like if you have all rules and no freedom, no rules is is is bad but better and then goes to crypto anarchy anarchy and and kind of in kind of building up to vision for a different civilization. What I find is ironic is in 99% of the um criticism I've seen online
3:05:44about him personally is accusing him of authoritarianism. Authoritarianism with the way he handled. So I thought that was ironic and I think it is the I don't know I just found that an observation because there are he followed up later about his commitment for decentralization and also what that looks like in terms of the forecaster reference client for network states a whole group of other network states network societies collaborating together
3:06:14under certain rules but that's still not 100% freedom right so if you're a full you know I don't like anything about network state or anything, there's no opportunity for another client for you. However, he said his commitment to putting the code open source. So, it's opportunity to to build your own.
3:06:31So, um he's taken a little bit he's taken a very opinionated stance to moderation. Yes. And and kind of the transition. It's opinionated, but I don't see it as authoritarianism if you can exit. And if and when he's talking about freedom of speech as well, right, that there's other avenues. So, I just thought that was interesting. um very interesting to talk about um broadcast rules. So that I didn't expect that. So talking about like the FCC, Federal
3:07:00Communications Commission, and the way the broadcast rules have always existed.
3:07:05They just changed because the digital um DMCA, which I'm going to forget, digital millennial copyright act, had a whole other set of rules specifically for the internet. A lot of that was around copyright as well, but there was also rules around um certain material that could not be broadcast and that's you know child you know child porn things like that where the platform was
3:07:33responsible for making sure that didn't seep through. So there's certain laws where like the platform is responsible for limiting illegal. I mean there's things content that is illegal and then there's that is what was the um what's the word from the uh from the law like the the broadcast it was like indecent or whatever indecent like it's different or it's like I know it when I see it. So right that is um yeah the I know when I
3:08:00see it is from a specific case um it was around pornography and whether or not what makes something what makes something pornography and obscene and it's yeah and a lot of times it's hard to define. So that's why I was saying that AI can define that better than even more so because there's so much to filter through it's almost impossible.
3:08:21So you got to remember like these rules around broadcast were when there were three networks and a and a couple local stations very easy to police because it's such limited content that I mean the the TV went off at night like right there was no it wasn't even 24 hours like like so you're talking about a whole different world at that point um but bringing back some of that civility and
3:08:50some of that like approach which is very interesting but also again like this is privatelyowned platform. So, you're allowed to do that when it's a privately owned platform. Um Um yeah, Samio said we'll be tech heavy arts likely need to start a new client. I saw other people kind of asking in questions about artists.
3:09:12I would just offer like if you're building a society, this is not Badre's take, this is mine.
3:09:18You don't want to silo arts away and you don't want to right like and you want to be able to kind of walk through a city. uh right um with beauty and design.
3:09:30Look at the building behind you.
3:09:35Um I mean that's more an opinionated design perspective for sure.
3:09:39Right. A lot of people were asking about kind of like oh what is there going to be an airdrop? Is there going to be a far caster token?
3:09:47Yeah. I mean, I don't even think listen, go listen to biology and see what he stands for, and you can make your own uh interpretation. But he did talk about not wanting to attract farmers, right, about not really appealing to the DGEN um kind of culture of crypto. And yet he talks about cryptography and he talks about blockchain from a very utilitarian standpoint. So I know he's very interested in Zcash.
3:10:14like Zcash. He was he was you know one of the proponents of USDC at Coinbase.
3:10:21So it was him and it was Jacob and him. I mean so it's not like so what I'm seeing is that it will likely be existing tokens that are used for the earn portion of this. It's USDC. It's Zcash. It's something like that that and we haven't talked about the computer the computer verse casino aspects in a long time.
3:10:41We really haven't. his casino took over.
3:10:43I think it's going to casino. It did. But now we're going back to computer.
3:10:49And I I welcome that. And then the other interpret like or the other thing I got from him just listening to him talk and you know is he really does seem to be consistent about having a positive some mindset.
3:11:06And I think that's it's easy to say, "Oh, I'm going to be positive some, right?" But he consistently kind of brought up this message about what that means and looking for win-win wins and not win versus loss. Like it's not, you know, or it's not some people win, some people lose. It's how do you set it up for everyone to have aligned incentives and and kind of and everyone wins.
3:11:29Um, so that appeals to me personally as well.
3:11:32And the I mean the I'm a I'm a lifelong learner, so like that always appeals to me. I'm a I'm a instructor at a university. So, of course, all of that's going to be very appealing to me.
3:11:42Um because I do think there's a lot of value in that regardless of whether or not that is for the incentive of earning or whether it's just to learn for the sake of learning. Like either one of those to me is interesting. And that again has been some of the appeal for me of Farcaster was the interesting people who had expertise. Like one of my favorite episodes this year was um TLDDR
3:12:11talking about the Odyssey, right?
3:12:14Like that we did that had nothing to do with technology. It had nothing to do with Farcaster. It was just this interesting person who we happen to know because of Farcaster who has this expertise who has literally translated, you know, the Odyssey from Greek um multiple times.
3:12:31Yeah. who we could get on a show and just talk about what do you think about this movie, you know what I mean? So, I think there's things about culture as well that can be, you know, integrated into this.
3:12:42Um, yeah, I think this is going to be I think it's an interesting time. It's going to be very different and I don't think there's going to be I mean, I think there's things that, you know, I wouldn't necessarily phrase it that way. I wouldn't lean so much into, you know, El Salvador makes me uncomfortable, things like that kind of comparison. Um, you know, things like that. But also, I get why he uses those.
3:13:08I understand the analogy. I understand why he's making analogies. He's a big analogy. Um, when he's when he talked about Singapore, and I hadn't read the the book. I'm some somewhat familiar with the history of Singapore, but not deeply. But it was making me think of um New York City from the Giuliani broken.
3:13:28That's what I was thinking about Time Square back in the 80s.
3:13:32Into and then into the Bloomberg era which was um honestly very different.
3:13:39Golden golden era New York City. I mean, when I was a kid, there's no way you would walk around Time Square. Yeah.
3:13:48You wouldn't walk around with You just wouldn't. And then I have walked around Time Square by myself multiple times as an adult in the past like five years just felt very safe. So, it's very difficult.
3:14:00Yeah. And I think it's easy to be critical probably about the harsh rules that get um uh um enforced probably in Singapore. I mean, my memory of Singapore, learning about Singapore growing up in the US in the 80s or 90s before the internet and that was just like it was they were so strict you weren't allowed to chew gum, right? So, you're like an elementary school student in the US and like they don't let you have candy or you get and then there was a public caning of a US teenager in the '9s.
3:14:29So, like you would hear this and it was just like that is anti-freedom, the worst thing ever. And then same about with the broken window policies and the stop and frisk and like there's a lot of criticism a lot of it you know but then to be able to intellectually I think look back over dec
3:14:50um how it is um enforced right the level like when you talk about stop and frisk is it enforced only in you know racial bias ways or is it enforced in a neutral that makes a big huge difference. So yeah, um there's a lot of there's a lot of nuance to all of this and I think that's the challenge. Um I know there's some folks talking about in the chat about you know building a bridge with um
3:15:20those who have either left the platform um because they didn't like the retroactive moderation um or you know those who were banned you know if they wanted to still appeal things like that. I think there's I think at this point that's going to be difficult um because there's almost like a tribal feeling which may not be helpful but it is what it is kind of
3:15:49thing. So, I think it would be challenging. But one of the questions I didn't get to ask that we just kept it kept going on and I kept forgetting to find a point to ask the question was can you change your vote? And I believe there was supposed to be a mechanism to do that, but I don't think it's currently working. So that if you opted in and you want to opt out or vice versa, I believe there will be that opportunity to do that. But I'm not
3:16:19positive that that is currently operational. So, it was a lot.
3:16:27It's a lot. It's a lot. Um, it's a lot.
3:16:31It's a lot. It's a lot. And I know there's a ton of stuff in the chat that we didn't get to. Um, so apologies there. There was just too many too many things happening. Um, attention trader did ask about when did biology um got interest in buying forecaster. We talked about at the very beginning, you probably missed it. It was about at the 30 minute mark when Rich was on with us and he talked a little bit about how that came about. So, if you go back to the beginning, you will likely get that
3:17:00answer there. Um, all right, Adrian, I have one last thing um that I need to quickly share and then see if there's anything else. Whoops, not that. Hold on. Um, thought I had it up, but here we go. Um, so I just want to share this really quick because I put up a couple proposals to help support the lobby. One to purple and one to yellow. Um, those are open for voting. So, this is just
3:17:29really like a shout out to anyone who's a member of purple or yellow. Um, go give those a read. They're open for voting for another couple days. Um, I think they end on the 28th, I believe, both of them. Um, so if you are interested in learning more, you can take a look at um, this cast will be in the show notes, but also you can also just go to um, either of these dows, purple or yellow, and read the proposal and it'll give you all the information
3:17:57you need. So, just wanted to mention that before I forgot. Um, anything else?
3:18:03I don't um, yes to crypto. I don't think so. not in terms of numbers but I believe that um Bology did have the best offer is my understanding. So um I think I mask was the other one they ended up buying um Clanker because that was um or was the other main one. I know there were multiple offers um in terms of Cassie's offer. You can see a little bit
3:18:33more of that. She had disclosed it early on and those numbers were different because it wasn't actually a cash offer. So, it was a little different. It was more um community takeover offer of like we'll just take we want to Yeah, we'll take it over.
3:18:49You'll have to continue paying. So, it wasn't really a wasn't really a buy offer and Rish was ready to move on. Um so, it wasn't really feasible. Um all right. Anything else, Adrian, before we wrap? That was a lot. We need to do clips for this one a little differently. We're going to have to like AI is not going to be able to clip this.
3:19:13Yeah, all the clips we've done are AI generated from And they've gotten better. They've gotten better.
3:19:18They have gotten better, but they're ain't going to work this time.
3:19:21Um, yeah, we're going to have to be a little more uh I think Warp is going to have a lot of work to do um as well to do some summarizing and things.
3:19:29Warp is good though. Take the transcript. Honestly, if we just take the transcript and ask it to just find the clippable mo like the best clippable moments, then it's it's a little easier. And then honestly, if we don't I I stopped clipping in vertical format because then it requires you to like change the format.
3:19:48So, if it's just clips and you share horizontal and it's a little easier that way. And I'm going to um I'm going to make sure I put a lot of chapters in this one um because I think that's going to be um necessary uh for this. All right, this is it for us this week. We won't be back until next Monday because uh Adrian's going to be doing some traveling. Um so we'll be back next Monday, I believe 11:30 a.m. Eastern. Um
3:20:17probably I assume we're Yeah, we haven't we haven't really discussed this, but I assume that's what we're doing. Um, anything else that you want to mention before we wrap? It's been a long one.
3:20:27We've almost hit episode 400. So excited to celebrate 400 episodes.
3:20:33Yep. So 399 will be next.
3:20:35Drinking from our 100 episode mug today.
3:20:40There it is. Um, we both picked the same mug today. That's funny. Um, all right everyone, we will see you next Monday. And until then everybody, bye-bye. Thanks for joining us for this episode of GM Farcaster. And thank you to all our partners and hypers sub supporters bringing this episode to you. Follow the GM Farcaster channel for all the latest updates and add our mini app on Farcaster and the base app. Until next time, bye-bye.
3:21:24Hey hey hey hey hey hey